[himbo]

InvalidScreen said:

Fanning the flames...

No, not really. Just failing, as I suspected would be the case. In addition to not providing less expensive or superior alternatives for most of the iLife apps (you only really provided one, actually, and it is arguable at best), you also have very confusingly implied that you both do and do not own a PC for your movie editing.

>iMovie -> ... If I wanted to work in a 'Windoze' manner I'd have bought a PC :) Perhaps they've sorted this out too. I'll stick with Sony Vegas (PC only, sigh).

[InvalidScreen]

himbo said:

) you also have very confusingly implied that you both do and do not own a PC for your movie editing.

> iMovie -> ... If I wanted to work in a 'Windoze' manner I'd have bought a PC :) Perhaps they've sorted this out too. I'll stick with Sony Vegas (PC only, sigh).

:) It's a an iMac that can run windows. We're no longer tied to having to use Mac only software.

[himbo]

So... you only work in a "Windoze" manner some of the time. Neat.

[InvalidScreen]

himbo said:

So... you only work in a "Windoze" manner some of the time. Neat.

Exactly, I use the best software for the problem, regardless of OS considerations :)

[JakeB]

Okay, InvalidScreen, let's see if we can help you make sense.

What's your proposed better and cheaper alternative to iDVD? Answer: VLC. Excellent for viewing all kinds of video files, but doesn't author DVDs. Like to try again?

What's your proposed better and cheaper alternative to iWeb? Answer: No reply, except to say it's too limited for you (what features does it lack that you're looking for?) You say you'd like to be able to FTP to a non-Apple site, but then admit you don't know if this feature exists in iWeb 09.

What's your proposed better and cheaper alternative to Garageband? Answer: No reply, except you tried it once and 'couldn't stop laughing?' Why? No reasons given for your implied contempt.

What's your proposed better and cheaper alternative to iMovie? Answer: Sony Vegas. The cheapest version retails for $55. Sounds like it also includes some functionality also found in iDVD, but you're getting close to iLife's $79. Plus it only runs on PC. You claim iMovie functions in a 'Windoze manner,' then say you prefer to use a Windows program. It's a 'Windoze manner' to hit the import button on iMovie?

What's your proposed better and cheaper alternative to iPhoto? Answer: Well, you say Picasa, but that's part of the sentence claiming any web-based photo service needs to be free, so it's unclear if you intended to claim Picasa is better than iPhoto. Plus, to state the obvious, iPhoto isn't a web-based application.

Always good to provide a clear reason to back up one's opinions. It stimulates real debate and grounds that debate in facts.

Your posts do neither.

Jake

[InvalidScreen]

JakeB said:

Okay, InvalidScreen, let's see if we can help you make sense.
What's your proposed better and cheaper alternative to iDVD? Answer: VLC. Excellent for viewing all kinds of video files, but doesn't author DVDs. Like to try again?

What's your proposed better and cheaper alternative to iWeb? Answer: No reply, except to say it's too limited for you (what features does it lack that you're looking for?) You say you'd like to be able to FTP to a non-Apple site, but then admit you don't know if this feature exists in iWeb 09.

What's your proposed better and cheaper alternative to Garageband? Answer: No reply, except you tried it once and 'couldn't stop laughing?' Why? No reasons given for your implied contempt.

What's your proposed better and cheaper alternative to iMovie? Answer: Sony Vegas. The cheapest version retails for $55. Sounds like it also includes some functionality also found in iDVD, but you're getting close to iLife's $79. Plus it only runs on PC. You claim iMovie functions in a 'Windoze manner,' then say you prefer to use a Windows program. It's a 'Windoze manner' to hit the import button on iMovie?

What's your proposed better and cheaper alternative to iPhoto? Answer: Well, you say Picasa, but that's part of the sentence claiming any web-based photo service needs to be free, so it's unclear if you intended to claim Picasa is better than iPhoto. Plus, to state the obvious, iPhoto isn't a web-based application.

Always good to provide a clear reason to back up one's opinions. It stimulates real debate and grounds that debate in facts.

Your posts do neither.

Jake

Cheaper? I asked whether it was worth $79, not whether there were cheaper alternatives. If you find one feature of the product set indispensable then it's probably a bargain, for you.


If you read my posts then I admitted my misktaken comparison of iDVD and VLC. I'm happy to be corrected.


GarageBand. What implied contempt? That's why I explicitly said it was fun. I enjoyed making music to the limits of my skills. If I'd have left it with me laughing then you could have implied contempt.


As an alternative to iWeb depends what you want to do. I'm happy to use an editor and manipulate XHTML. I appreciate some people don't want to do this and for them iWeb may be ideal. I found it too restrictive to get the look I wanted.


iMovie, ditto, cheapness is not the argument, but I'd expect a Mac program to have great Mac functionality, not to dig around in menus for something that should be intuitive. Is that too much to ask?


I think Picasa is better than iPhoto 08. iPhoto 09 doesn't seem to offer much more, but I haven't tried it. I can only go on reviews like this. Some people have said they prefer iPhoto's interface. Great. Picasa isn't just a web application, it's a stand alone first class Mac application, download it and try it. I'd argue that Picasa has better web functionality if you use the Google application stack. iPhoto may be better if you use the Mac application stack.


Also you've misrepresented my quote on photos and free. The photos need to be free, as in freed to the web, not necessarily the application needs to be free ;)
Feel free to continue the debate.
===

edited, fixed typos

[wigby]

so what apple apps do you like on your mac? it sounds like you just run windows apps on a mac which makes little sense to me. most would agree that apple hardware alone is overpriced and you might have a point about some apple software being overpriced too but apple works because of its integration between hardware and software. ilife is a great suite of apps that run for all levels of artists, professionals and consumers. i use final cut pro and can't personally stand imovie but i see it's ability to empower casual users too. i haven't heard of any other software bundles that approach ilife's user interface, power and features on the mac or any pc for the only $79.

[Chris Wiley]

To answer the question directly: yes, the iLife Suite is worth $79.00. If these applications were shareware, (Incredibly high quality shareware at that), each would easily be worth $30 a piece. Look! Already at 90 bucks! (Excuse me--$120 total! What a value!)

This is in no way says that Picasa isn't a good application, however.

The real point to be made is that your question is disingenuous bud. You've apparently already made up your mind.

Oh wait! You're a TROLL!

Someone hand me the pliers...

[InvalidScreen]

That's a good question. The purchase of the iMac was driven by the fact that I needed a semi-portable, large screen computer with some windows compatibility. The purchase was not based around any must-have software that only ran on the Mac.

What I like about the mac is it's desktop integration. Beats windows hands down. Drag things onto something else, the mac generally knows what to do. Intelligent scrolling, auto-pop folders, etc, etc. A real boon to productivity.

The hardware aesthetics are great too. Apple know how to design great looking hardware.

So what Apple software do I use regularly, probably only iTunes, as I haven't found anything to replace it yet. My calendar and address book are web based, though they are synced locally and I occasionally crank up Address Book and iCal. xCode looks like a decent development environment, but I'm a Java developer and use Eclipse. Shame Apple's commitment to Java is a little slow. Time Machine is also a great software product.

iTunes is a good example of the problem with mac software. Been around for a while, generally works well but has some fairly serious issues. When using iTunes, import music and the UI locks up. You can't do anything else with it. Why? Who knows, there is no real reason, import could, and should, be done in the background.

Safari, great browser but lacks the expandabiity of Firefox. I like adblock, session management, firebug for web development, etc

Numbers, a great spreadsheet program but doesn't do something as basic as freeze-pane. If you've got a spreadsheet with a few thousand rows and more than a handful of columns, then you need to freeze headers. Yes, there are some novel ways around this, but what's up with freeze-pane? I use OpenOffice.

I do use alot of mac third party software, commercial and freeware.

Your point on hardware and software integration and enabling causual users is spot on. I have many friends who have bought Apple because it's intuitive to do things with and robust. I guess my requirements are at the edge of the bell-curve, so not representative of most people. Doesn't stop me wanting great Apple software though.

[InvalidScreen]

Chris Wiley said:

To answer the question directly: yes, the iLife Suite is worth $79.00. I

Oh wait! You're a TROLL!

Someone hand me the pliers...

I'm glad you find it great value, as that was the question. I read the review of iPhoto and didn't see anything in it that would convince me to upgrade. It's the one part of the product set that I could potentially use. You obviously have and that's cool.



Not sure what the troll reference is? Or why it's necessary...

[aceshelman]

Cons:
-- Faces isn't good at its job.
-- Red-Eye removal is terrible. My mom has HP software that came with her camera that batch fixes photos (if desired) or does an entire photo at once with a -much- nicer effect than the zombie eyes or hole-in-the-socket looks iPhoto gives you. Bleh.

[trip1ex]

Ignore Invalid Screen. He's just baiting you all. And you're biting. Look at his join date. He just wants some attention. He's bored. :)

I bought the new suite. I haven't installed it yet. I mostly upgraded because my wife just got into the Facebook craze.

[veggiedude]

[quote name='folklore']
>

bugjuice said:

> I personally don't like how iPhoto makes copies and copies of each photo, making the space it consumes, monstrous.

OTOH, the multiple thumbnails make iPhoto very fast to preview images, even when the library is huge (especially when you use the preset sizes). Keeping an "original" copy allows users to revert to an unaltered photo. Keeping additional copies for iPods and AppleTVs keeps the sync process from taking forever. Resizing the photos on the fly for each sync would get old in a hurry.

It's not like Apple's engineers just decided to make copies willy-nilly in order to waste space. They made a conscious decision to sacrifice hard drive space in order to gain performance.

I'm okay with that. I can always buy more hard drive space.

It is called non-destructive editing.

[maddoguk]

Okay - played with Faces for an evening. Next!