[spinoza2]

"5) For those of you not familiar with the history of your operating system it was designed on a pc. It is a custom version of FREEBsd, designed, written and run on pcs (NOT) long before it ever touched an apple logo."

NeXTStep was actually based on Unix Mach Kernel from Carnegie Mellon University, and was supplemented by BSD Unix. It was not developed on a PC, but rather a Sun Solaris Workstation.

The OS X GUI does possess a lot of the elements of earlier Mac OSs, but it is built upon NeXTstep foundations (OpenStep, actually). Then again, Jobs of course took many of his Mac ideas with him in developing the NeXTStep GUI.

PCs were absolutely not in the mix...

[lord_xaero]

No, I don't work for free. Neither do the countless software developers writing pc apps out of their garage. However if you look on the net. you will find many people that with the spirit of innovation code apps under the GPL for the sheer joy of writing code. They don't want to sell 300 farting noismakers on the itunes store. they want to make something for the good of all pc users. Sourceforge is one such repository of all that is right with pc and wrong with the mighty blue apple. GPL gotta love it.

[spinoza2]

"There is also the mistaken assumption that Apple would then be on the road to "catering to the needs of everyone" if it comes out with a mid-range tower (or beefier iMac). I see no logic whatsoever behind that thinking."

You don't, but you know what, just 'up the road' in another discussion thread someone else is clamoring for a Mac tablet, in the discussion across the way another is complaining that Apple isn't bringing out a cheaper iPhone, and in another thread a participant just can't understand why Apple is not coming out with a netbook. And then there is that loud ten percent minority who can't stand the glossy displays of the new Mac lineup, those that can't believe Apple dropped Firewire 400, and geez, I'm really ticked off that Apple isn't coming out with a purple iPhone. What are they thinking!

[folklore]

lord_xaero said:

No, I don't work for free. Neither do the countless software developers writing pc apps out of their garage. However if you look on the net. you will find many people that with the spirit of innovation code apps under the GPL for the sheer joy of writing code. They don't want to sell 300 farting noismakers on the itunes store. they want to make something for the good of all pc users. Sourceforge is one such repository of all that is right with pc and wrong with the mighty blue apple. GPL gotta love it.

Uh... the GPL is platform agnostic.

And maybe it's just me, but I've found many more useful low-cost and free apps for OS X than I ever did as a Windows user.

[lord_xaero]

it wasn't a remark...It was a hard fact. you use Free bsd.

No macosx isn't the same old NeXT os. it is a custom shell on a free os WE the pc users that support true innovation wrote for the betterment of all. It was released under the GPL. it isn't put together on anything DARWIN is MACOSX and DARWIN IS FREEBSD PERIOD. what you cling to is aPretty gui, loaded on top of an operating system written for x86 hardware on x86 hardware.

I remeber when the top of the line mac was an 040, and back then the mac rant was "we run our own special chips running our own special ram with our own special hard drives, our own special ports and our own os, we will never give any of that up!" Just a few short years later you depend on intel not motorola, you get your ram from the same suppliers as me, SCSI is dead, firewire might as well be dead, and you had to borrow one of our old operating systems to make it all work. Congratulations, I hope you enjoy your obsolete pc software, we have moved on. We innovate with our hardware. Not follow blindly with the same 4 pricepont junk that every other sheep in the herd has. I can honestly say there is NO mac on earth with the power of the machine on my desk. 2 proccesors (8 total cores), 3 gtx 295s, 6TB of hard drive, 16GB of ram running my choice of operating system INCLUDING your beloved MACosX I can do what I WANT with MY hardware, how about you? Overclock, no. Install the latest unapproved app, no. Watch a blu ray movie, no. On your non approved, non hdmi hdtv, no. If thats an Ilife, I want a real one. And for the record I have several apps that directly clone the mac os interface on pcs.

A little math.. simple problem really. Free BSD=free(duh) free free BSD + pretty blue apple logo=$226

how about linuxshell copied right from OSXhardware support for ANY parts YOU WANT=FREE

us pc users must be stupid we give complete operating systems away just to make the world a better place.

The way I see it Both windows and OSX have it wrong but untill I see that windows has 7% market share and OSX has93% I'll assume we have it right.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FreeBSD

http://www.apple.com...ology/unix.html

http://www.derkeiler...04-12/0161.html

[folklore]

lord_xaero said:

Install the latest unapproved app, no.

Usually, I don't feed the trolls.

But I do have a quibble with your rant: There is no approval process for Mac software. For iPhone software, yes. But not for Mac software. Anyone can run anything they wish on a Mac. Including, by the way, Windows.

[lord_xaero]

Funny thing about that. I upgrade my pc when NEW software that is better than what I am running comes out. (as do most people) Innovation drives progress progress drives innovators. Blueray for instance requires more computing power to render the frames than say mpg1. While an old computer hooked up to a blueray drive could technically render everything properly. It could not do so with the restrictions placed by content providers. This is of course a pc problem only since you cannot enjoy blueray on a mac. No need to upgrade then. By the time you have to buy a new mac to watch HD movies, we will already be playing with the next innovation you can admire for 3-4 years before you get it too. pc's go through a shorter development cycle. hardware that is 5 years old for pcs might as well be a hundred.

[spinoza2]

Dude, you really don't know what you're talking about, your own links prove you wrong. FreeBSD 1.0 was released in 1993, fully four years after NeXTStep was released. By 1993 NeXTStep was already well on the way to becoming platform-independent OpenStep. I know because I was a NeXTStep developer.

You may think you can say anything you want on the Internet and make it sound like you're some kind of authority, but fortunately there are enough of us who know to keep you in line.

[lord_xaero]

I am sorry but I happen to KNOW for a fact that NeXT STEP and open Step were shelved in favor of BSD. I know this for two very good reasons. One used to work in cupertino the other still does. The development time to throw away everything and start over with a new kernel for a company on the verge of bankrupcy(just prior to Jobs return) would be years and years of development and MILLIONS of dollars. Reskinning a free os (BSD) would have benefits in both licensing rights and in a much accelerated time to market. The extra bonus was it already ran on pc hardware, so it would be no problem to port it to the intel hardware Jobs brought with him on his return. Now you may be right about the gui but the "guts" were coded on x86 machines in berkley. A word on security. A famous bank robber asked why he robbed banks, responded "because thats where the money is" to put it another way a virus coder could write a virus that crashed every mac in the world and it would only touch 6% of the computers on earth. Whatever flavor of Unix you like to think you have under the hood, it is far less secure than even the worst unpatched windows there is. However nobody cares. Writing viruses for macs is like designing smart weapons to shoot down santa. It's not worth the trouble.

[lord_xaero]

Actually that was against the Iphone. And it's good you can run windows. You must understand I don't dislike macs. I just dislike the Apple attitude on a few things. Their one size fits all mentality really bugs me. And yes I am aware you can (kinda) run windows. Vmware fusion is great, I have vmware and several patched versions of OSX86. Anyone can run anything thats available for the mac on a mac. and with the realese of several osx86 any pc can run anything available on a mac. making the hardware too expensive which is STILL my point.

[Macalways]

So you are one of those philanthropists who like to make money by taking advantage of others. Otherwise, you would support by buying a product or two as opposed to your demented penchant for FREEbies as you so indicated.

[sassy3]

Kay also insists, for some reason, that the family buy an AirPort Extreme router for $180 instead of the $150 Linksys Wireless N router that he budgeted for the PCs, despite the fact that the Mac and Linksys routers are interoperable. You could save another $30 (or—and I know this is going out on a limb—you could spend the extra $30 to buy the AirPort Extreme for the PC side because it's a better product. Hey, it's an option
Save it all, I've been running 5 Macs on a Software Base Station for 8+ years with no problems, share Applications, Screen Sharing, Time Capsule, Printers, Scanners, external HD (SuperDuper for 2 Tiger Macs) and internet connection. Also control my iTunes through it using Remote App on my iPod Touch. Has worked great and is all password protected with about 90% of our 2 Acres covered so I can work from anywhere. Still run VPC with 98 & XP Pro on one of the Tiger Macs and have complete control through my main Mac with Screen Sharing.

[spinoza2]

"I am sorry but I happen to KNOW for a fact that NeXT STEP and open Step were shelved in favor of BSD. "

I don't know what kind of alternate reality you're living in, but you need help: just do some checking on the Web and you'll get the help you need (this is from an early OS X developer):

"It would be an understatement to say that OS X is derived from NEXTSTEP and OPENSTEP. In many respects, it's not just similar, it's the same. One can think of it as OpenStep 5 or 6, say. This is not a bad thing at all - rather than create an operating system from scratch, Apple tried to do the smart thing, and used what they already had to a great extent. However, the similarities should not mislead you: Mac OS X is evolved enough that what you can do with it is far above and beyond NEXTSTEP/OPENSTEP."