[Steve_S]

dwd3885 said:

I'm not a MS fanboy. I was just saying the criticism the Zune gets is unwarranted. It's a really good device and this one looks even better.

Unfortunately, you only get one chance to make a first impression. The criticism of the original Zune, including the total setup experience was completely justified. The size of the device along with the overall clunky design were open for criticism as compared to the iPod. Are newer designs better? Perhaps. But, being better than the original Zune isn't saying much. It has to be better than the iPod to get anyone's attention. It's not. Even if by some miracle, Microsoft is able to produce a better iPod, now what? You still have to compete with iTunes. Overall, Zune 3 doesn't compare well to iTunes 8.

Even now, we're talking about rumors of Microsoft matching 2 year old technology from Apple. Is that really exciting? Microsoft isn't about innovation, it's about trying to get a piece of the pie for any given market. Microsoft doesn't have a monopoly here and likewise has a hard time competing. They have the money to stay in the game, but they don't have the DNA to get anyone excited about their work. Staying two years behind Apple's technology curve isn't going change anything.

[Steve_S]

grossnicklaus_a said:

Everyone that talks about products like they were the one who designed the better one and everyone else is copying them, is a "fan boy." The truth of the matter is that they both created a good product but Apple has taken their's further then Microsoft has and Microsoft made a late decision to try to catch up. The Zune is nothing like the Ipod exept for the fact that it 1. plays music and 2. it is a piece of hardware and 3. it has software on it. Apple didn't invent any of those things. If anything apple copied Archos who basically pioneered large HD based Mp3 players. The thing that Apple did to separate them from Archos was make the Ipod B&W and not give it the ability to play video's.

Similarly, those who attempt to diminish Apple's accomplishments by attempting to trivialize their work are similarly fanboys, just not Apple fanboys. ;-) Seriously, wind the clock back a few years and buying anything "Apple" was not considered cool, including the iPod. If making the device black and white was all it took to win the market, then why didn't Archos win? Why wasn't Microsoft able to catch up? If that's really what you think, you're a bit delusional or minimally just misinformed. Do remember how think the Archos box was? Have you ever seen one? Have you ever seen how many buttons and the type of confusing interface that existed back then? Apple made a very sleek device as compared to the competition and used the click wheel interface. To this day, for a portable music player, this is the most efficient design. On top of that, Apple mated the device to the best music Jukebox software, iTunes. This was a one, two punch that nobody could adequately answer for years. Even if the asian based copycat companies mimicked the hardware, they couldn't mimic the overall user experience. On top of that, Apple was first to work out deals with the record labels to legally sell music on-line, etc. Everyone has been copying Apple and Apple's business model since that time. No, they didn't invent everything, but they invented the aspects that differentiated their products from the competition.

[People_Eater]

grossnicklaus_a said:

If anything apple copied Archos who basically pioneered large HD based Mp3 players. The thing that Apple did to separate them from Archos was make the Ipod B&W and not give it the ability to play video's.

Oh yes... Apple copied Archos by releasing a massive brick of a device that used a 2.5" laptop hard drive for storage and slow USB 1.1 for file transfer, and had an awkward user interface. The only difference was that Apple crippled it by removing video features.

Oh wait, that never happened. Apple released a small, thin player that was the first to use the new micro hard drives, and used speedy Firewire 400 for file transfer, and had an innovative new user interface that could navigate large music collections, combined with music library software designed to work explicitly with the device.

Do you have any idea how ridiculous your comment looks? One would have to be seriously out of touch woth reality to believe that the iPod was inspired by the Archos.