[bastion]

jescott418, on 06 June 2012 - 02:48 AM, said:

Of course Mountain Lion will do nothing to help those that like the pureness of Snow Leopard.

If I drank coffee I would be cleaning it off my keyboard now. Snow Leopard is "pure?" Funny. Only a few years ago Mac-oriented forums were full of people complaining about how superfluous, disappointing and misguided Snow Leopard was. Leopard was the end of the line for the "real" Mac OS and the "real" Mac users that Apple was abandoning. Of course, two years before that Leopard was the pretender king to Tiger's pure goodness. Oh, wait: Tiger had its detractors, too. So did Panther. Few people complained about Jaguar or Puma, but Mac OS X itself spelled the end of the line for the "pure" Mac experience once. But that's okay, because so had Mac OS 9. And 8 and 7. 4-6 were relatively low-key releases, but 3...that annoyed a lot of people. (Folders and 31-character filenames screwed up peoples' workflows something fierce. No, I'm not kidding.) The Mac itself? Oh, that was an awful machine that wasn't compatible with anything else, didn't look or work like any prior machine that a typical user of the day understood and insulated you too much from the reality of the computer - preventing you from getting real work done. Clearly Apple was dumbing down computers for the ignorant, lazy masses and thumbing their corporate nose at their loyal users in the deal.

You're going to have to help me understand what qualifies one OS version as more pure than another. The Apple *I've* known and dealt with for 30+ years was quite literally founded on the principle of disruptive change.

[anchored]

jescott418, on 06 June 2012 - 02:48 AM, said:

Actually their are so many reasons I would stick with Snow Leopard if I could. Biggest one is that it has not been tainted by IOS stuff that I could care less about. Of course Mountain Lion will do nothing to help those that like the pureness of Snow Leopard. Lot's of questions in my mind about weather Lion really has many features that benefit anyone? I find myself using my older Macbook with SL then my new Macbook Pro with Lion. I guess because I am one of those Mac users that does not have a iPhone,a iPad or care to own one. So the IOS gimmicks as I call them are rather useless. My only consolation is that a least I don't have to use them.

I do have an iPhone and have purchased an iPad for my mother. I love the iPhone and the way IOS works but I detest those same behaviors on my mac! I hate the rubber band effect, and the way you can rubber band horizontally. If those behaviors have some use for those using a trackpad, fine, but let mouse users turn it off! In addition to the behaviors adopted from IOS, I find Lion to be buggy, example: I set my finder to appear as a list, and somehow that setting changes on its own, also I command tab to another app and that app stays in the background, behind other open apps or windows. I also find that Apple is doing other things with the interface that seem counterproductive. One example is the lack of scroll bars, until you enable them. Even then they don't have the arrows at the bottom, which I used. Apple also seems to be hiding elements of the interface, assuming we know they they exist, example in Mail, when you mouse over the the division between the header and the message a tool bar appears containing delete, forward, forward all and reply. In addition, this tool bar are only icons, no labels. What if someone is not familiar with the meaning of the icons? It seems to me that everything available should be obvious and not hidden or a mystery!!! These changes in the Operating systems behavior are reminding me of the reasons that I switched for Microsoft to Apple in the first place. I hope that they get their act together!

[Photonerd]

Thank you!

[PeterGalloway]

@rbhix right on, it's an easy visual indication, particular with a no-moving-parts interface device like the trackpad (which I love) that things are happening.

[Jasonmwa]

bastion, on 06 June 2012 - 04:57 AM, said:

jescott418, on 06 June 2012 - 02:48 AM, said:

Of course Mountain Lion will do nothing to help those that like the pureness of Snow Leopard.

If I drank coffee I would be cleaning it off my keyboard now. Snow Leopard is "pure?" Funny. Only a few years ago Mac-oriented forums were full of people complaining about how superfluous, disappointing and misguided Snow Leopard was. Leopard was the end of the line for the "real" Mac OS and the "real" Mac users that Apple was abandoning. Of course, two years before that Leopard was the pretender king to Tiger's pure goodness. Oh, wait: Tiger had its detractors, too. So did Panther. Few people complained about Jaguar or Puma, but Mac OS X itself spelled the end of the line for the "pure" Mac experience once. But that's okay, because so had Mac OS 9. And 8 and 7. 4-6 were relatively low-key releases, but 3...that annoyed a lot of people. (Folders and 31-character filenames screwed up peoples' workflows something fierce. No, I'm not kidding.) The Mac itself? Oh, that was an awful machine that wasn't compatible with anything else, didn't look or work like any prior machine that a typical user of the day understood and insulated you too much from the reality of the computer - preventing you from getting real work done. Clearly Apple was dumbing down computers for the ignorant, lazy masses and thumbing their corporate nose at their loyal users in the deal.

You're going to have to help me understand what qualifies one OS version as more pure than another. The Apple *I've* known and dealt with for 30+ years was quite literally founded on the principle of disruptive change.

Perhaps I wasn't watching Mac forums since the inception of OS X but I've not seen such a negative view towards an update as I have with Lion. Yes, there will always be those who preferred an earlier version but Lion has become THE hated update. I don't understand it myself; as you say, changes are made all the time. But the outcry, posts such as this article that disables a part of the UI (there have been many) that is significant in this OS version, people just hate it. What I find interesting is more tech savvy individuals seem to be the haters. I don't see someone's grandpa ranting about such changes. After all, it's like his iPhone! But being the haters are tech savvy seems they would have kept up with features and would be better informed whether or not they wanted to use Lion. Yet they bought it anyway I think in part to hate it.

With the exception of Versions, which I like as a concept but not in actual use, I like Lion. I knew what to expect before I got into it. My coworkers, consumers not tech pros, love it. I liked Spaces and Exposé, liked obvious access to the Library folder but I don't see Lion as the grand departure of form so many think it is. It's an amalgamation Of X and i, does that mean haters don't like using their iPhones and iPads. It's inevitable that the two will bleed into one another. I don't believe a unified version will come to light like Windows 8 but there is a need cohesion between mobile and desktop. That's what ruins the "purity" of Lion. Snow Leopard and the cats before were desktop OSes. They were, while creative and groundbreaking when compared to Windows, they were still for computers. More tech pros lament the loss of this to a consumeration of the OS, an OS for the masses.

[bastion]

Jasonmwa, on 12 June 2012 - 10:49 AM, said:

Perhaps I wasn't watching Mac forums since the inception of OS X but I've not seen such a negative view towards an update as I have with Lion. Yes, there will always be those who preferred an earlier version but Lion has become THE hated update.

Well, no. That's what I'm saying: Lion has become the hated CURRENT update. Which, you know, being the current version is pretty much a given. I wasn't joking or exaggerating in the slightest in my prior post. Almost every major release of the Mac OS I've been around for has been decried by a very vocal minority who will brook no disagreement as the end of the "real" Mac and the unarguable sign of Apple's contempt for "real" Mac users.

It really is virtually indistinguishable from the reaction to the Mac itself in 1984.

[MarkusKnaup]

It works in Coda 2!

[GrantWiggins7ase]

I just downloaded a new episode of Top Chef to my MAC. Due to the stupid bouncing feature, the episode is unviewable and unclickable for syncing via a mouse - I tried for 20 minutes. In fact it took me 5 mins. to check back in the store that it has been downloaded at all. In the new iTunes the problem is even worse than before because you cannot see a text list of your shows.

Incredibly dumb.I say this as someone who bought the original MAC when it came out and has been a dedicated MAC user for over 2 decades. Why would anyone think that this is a good feature?

[bastion]

GrantWiggins7ase, on 13 December 2012 - 07:40 AM, said:

I just downloaded a new episode of Top Chef to my MAC. Due to the stupid bouncing feature, the episode is unviewable and unclickable for syncing via a mouse - I tried for 20 minutes. In fact it took me 5 mins. to check back in the store that it has been downloaded at all. In the new iTunes the problem is even worse than before because you cannot see a text list of your shows.

Incredibly dumb.I say this as someone who bought the original MAC when it came out and has been a dedicated MAC user for over 2 decades. Why would anyone think that this is a good feature?

MAC is a cosmetics chain, a defunct EFT network, and a network hardware addressing scheme. It is not, and never has been, a computer and I consider that an odd mistake to make - going out of ones way to hold down the shift key for longer than necessary as if it's an acronym - for someone who claims to have been using Macs for 29 years.

The rest of your post makes about as little sense to me. This feature is good in that it provides some positive feedback to users when they've reached the end of a scrollable region. If you don't like it, you can easily turn it off and not be bothered by it, unless you're the sort of person who's bothered by the mere existence of something they don't value. And I don't see at all how this behavior could have the impact you described for your video consumption. How does bouncing at the edge of a scroll area affect your ability to view a video or click on something? And, as a completely unrelated matter, why can *you* not see a list of your shows in the new iTunes? I can. Ultimately, there's nothing in your post that is consistent with the reality I live in.