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Missing Scrolling Arrow in OS x

#1 User is offline   sunnyone 

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Posted 25 November 2013 - 02:59 PM

OK, after just having "upgraded" from Snow Leopard to Mavericks I have to say that the most ludicrous thing Apple ever did was to eliminate the vertical and horizontal scrolling arrows!

Do these people really use this software? I'm in an Illustrator drawing and the elimination of the scrolling arrows is the absolute DUMBEST thing Apple could have done.

I have a really large drawing that requires a lot of moving around in. Since Apple eliminated the scrolling arrows, now I have to switch to the hand tool to move around in the document, then re-select the editing or work tool I was using to make changes or add information - and every time you want to move to a new location you have to go through this procedure again. Or, I can go down to the scroll bar and try to pick the place holder in either the horizontal or vertical scroll areas to move around in the document. Either option is really STUPIDLY asinine. The larger the document is the faster you end up moving in the window using the button in the scroll areas, which means you will most likely overshoot where you want to end up. Before I could just go to the vertical or horizontal arrows and scroll to the location I wanted then continue working -- no change in tools required - what a bizarre novelty.

I always thought Apple was supposed to be the company that made things easier. Only a moron would consider this an improvement over the prior methodology. It might make sense if you are working in Illustrator on a tablet (right) but sure as hell it isn't on ANY desktop using a mouse.

Come on Apple, get your head out of your butt and look at how much harder you've now made working in all of these programs!

What is even scarier is that so few people must now be using Macs for productivity now that this is no big deal!
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#2 User is offline   Chris Breen 

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Posted 25 November 2013 - 03:10 PM

View Postsunnyone, on 25 November 2013 - 02:59 PM, said:

Come on Apple, get your head out of your butt and look at how much harder you've now made working in all of these programs!


At the risk of sounding like an Apple fanboy, you've accused Apple of something dastardly in earlier posts when, in fact, you simply weren't familiar enough with its features to understand how the OS now operates. Some research would have helped you in this case as well. You can press the H key to quickly switch to the Hand tool or you can hold down the spacebar to temporarily select this tool and then switch back to the previous tool by letting go of the spacebar.

If learning these new skills is more trouble than you believe it's worth you can always reinstall Snow Leopard, as I've suggested before.

#3 User is offline   Martian 

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Posted 25 November 2013 - 03:59 PM

I have another suggestion. Try a Bluetooth trackpad. Super easy and precise scrolling using two fingers on a trackpad is just one reason why Apple trackpads with all their gestures are absolutely brilliant. Apple's execution of the the trackpad must certainly be part of the reason Mac notebooks have taken so much market share. There is no reason you shouldn't have one next to your mouse on a Mac desktop machine.
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#4 User is offline   sunnyone 

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Posted 26 November 2013 - 05:18 PM

Not to be contrarian, but why should I have to learn something new when I've been using these programs with no issues whatsoever for the past 6-7 years? Same applies to my previous issues with the Finder and keyboard.

I shouldn't have to search the net or through the OS Help screens to "learn" a new methodology when the original was working just fine. This is not a simple change to the OS from my perspective. The only reason Apple made this change was to make OS X more like iOS. I've tried tablets and found them useless for my needs.

As for the trackpad, why should I now have to buy an additional piece of hardware to obtain the functionality that was previously built in - other than to dole out more money.

Removing the scroll arrows did nothing to improve the functionality of the software and in fact made it less functional and only created a need to waste time trying to figure out a work-around.

It would not have been such a big issue if this bozo move didn't require having to re-learn elements of every software program that runs on the Mac.

Oh, and I read all the reviews of Lion, Mountain Lion, and Mavericks I could find on MacUser and MacWorld and don't recall ANY of those reviews talking about the elimination of the scroll arrows or the change to the Finder. I guess I might have missed them, but I doubt it as I would think such a major change would be a fairly significant point of discussion.

Yes, I could go back to Snow Leopard. On the other hand, the decision whether or not to upgrade would have been much clearer if this information were available before I made the switch.

I use my Macs for work so I really don't have the time to waste "discovering" these improvements.
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#5 User is offline   sunnyone 

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Posted 26 November 2013 - 05:30 PM

BTW, here is the post where I actually found out about the "missing" Scroll arrows and it appears I'm not the only one who thinks this was not a good idea -


.
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#6 User is offline   sunnyone 

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Posted 26 November 2013 - 05:32 PM

Sorry, I hit enter before I was able to add the link -


https://discussions....959267#22959267
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#7 User is offline   Chris Breen 

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Posted 26 November 2013 - 05:49 PM

View Postsunnyone, on 26 November 2013 - 05:18 PM, said:

Not to be contrarian, but why should I have to learn something new when I've been using these programs with no issues whatsoever for the past 6-7 years?


Why should you have to learn something new when you purchase a new television or camera or thermostat or microwave or coffee maker? Because as technologies advance and change it behooves us to understand how they work. If you're not interested in these new technologies then of course you can stay right where you are.

Quote

Oh, and I read all the reviews of Lion, Mountain Lion, and Mavericks I could find on MacUser and MacWorld and don't recall ANY of those reviews talking about the elimination of the scroll arrows or the change to the Finder. I guess I might have missed them, but I doubt it as I would think such a major change would be a fairly significant point of discussion.


Here.
And here.
And here.
And here.

I agree that losing the arrow buttons was shocking -- and I said so in a couple of these pieces. But they're gone. And once I accepted that they were I found other ways to move through the Mac's interface, to the point where I can't imagine using them again.

#8 User is offline   smax013 

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Posted 14 December 2013 - 12:53 PM

View Postsunnyone, on 26 November 2013 - 05:18 PM, said:

Not to be contrarian, but why should I have to learn something new when I've been using these programs with no issues whatsoever for the past 6-7 years? Same applies to my previous issues with the Finder and keyboard.


If you have upgraded just about ANY software program or computer OS over the years, then you should know that you tend to have to learn new things when you upgrade to a new version of program or OS. That is pretty SOP. This means that you have to decide whether it is worth upgrading to get the new features or whether it makes sense to stick with what you have because it works and you don't want to learn new things.

So, the simple answer is that if you didn't want to learn new things, then you never should have upgraded from Snow Leopard.

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Oh, and I read all the reviews of Lion, Mountain Lion, and Mavericks I could find on MacUser and MacWorld and don't recall ANY of those reviews talking about the elimination of the scroll arrows or the change to the Finder. I guess I might have missed them, but I doubt it as I would think such a major change would be a fairly significant point of discussion.


Sorry, but as Chris Breen noted by providing specific links, I definitely recall reviews of Lion mentioning the changes to the scroll bars in Lion, including the lack of arrows. So, you either did not read those reviews (more than likely not EVERY review mentioned it, but then there were LOTS of changes in Lion and I have no doubt that not every review mentioned every change) or you gloss over/forgot that part.

Now, I agree (as did Chris Breen in at least one of the articles that he linked to) that the change in the scroll bars is rather annoying, if not a real pain in the you know what. But, they are not changing. You can continue to gripe about it 'til you are blue in the face, but all you will get out of it is a blue face. Apple is likely not going to change it back if they have not changed it back yet (Lion was released like 2 years go). Plus, griping here on Macworld likely will have zero chance of getting Apple to change their mind. If there was any hope of getting Apple to change their mind, then you should be griping to them via their feedback page (http://www.apple.com...ack/macosx.html). Considering there were likely hundreds, if not thousands, of people who may have done that back when the switch was originally made with Lion, I am guessing that it is a was of time.

So, that means your posts gripping about this will only accomplish one of two things:

1) Allow you to vent. If this is your goal, then mission accomplished. You vented. Did it help? :)

2) You can get suggestions on how to deal with this change. Again, mission accomplished. People have in good faith offered suggestions on how you can deal with this change ranging from ways to stick with the new OS and doing what you used to do in new ways to switching back to Snow Leopard and keep doing things that way you have been doing it. Take their suggestions or don't.
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