Sign In
Register
Help
Post your comments for How Psystar's computer measures up to a Mac here
How Psystar's computer measures up to a Mac
MultiQuote
#2
jhorvatic 
- Member
-
- Group: Members
- Posts: 47
- Joined: 07-March 06
Posted 08 May 2008 - 10:00 AM
No software support, no hardware support, no iLife suite. Those alone are worth the price of a Mac Mini even if it is a little slower. Not to mention Psystar is illegal. It will soon be a worthless paperweight sitting on someone's floor.
#3
leicaman
- Veteran
-
- Group: Members
- Posts: 1,691
- Joined: 04-December 03
Posted 08 May 2008 - 10:13 AM
I seem to remember their early marketing materials were comparing their Open Pro to the low end Mac Pro. But that comparison seems to have disappeared, at least mentioning prices. I would find it interesting to see how their high-end ($999) machine competes with Mac Pros.
#4
fds
- Member
-
- Group: Members
- Posts: 105
- Joined: 16-September 04
Posted 08 May 2008 - 10:21 AM
Strong feeling against Psystar, hah, you don't say. That's quite an understatement. Why would Macworld have an obligation to test something obviously law-breaking?
When's the article on comparing pirated copies of movies and TV shows to their iTunes Store versions coming?
I hope you'll choose to pay for the pirated movies to some shady unrelated third-party reseller as well.
When's the article on comparing pirated copies of movies and TV shows to their iTunes Store versions coming?
I hope you'll choose to pay for the pirated movies to some shady unrelated third-party reseller as well.
#5
George76
- Member
-
- Group: Members
- Posts: 218
- Joined: 22-December 06
Posted 08 May 2008 - 10:23 AM
jhorvatic said:
No software support, no hardware support, no iLife suite. Those alone are worth the price of a Mac Mini even if it is a little slower. Not to mention Psystar is illegal. It will soon be a worthless paperweight sitting on someone's floor.
Sounds like there is some level of support based on the conversation with the Psystar rep mentioned in the article. There's really nothing killer in the iLife suite. The only one I use on a regular basis is iTunes and that can be had for free and I have very little use for iWeb or Garage Band.
I suppose it's in the questionable legality area violating the EULA, but I find it to be an interesting experiment. Sounds like if they were allowed to continue and grow they could turn out a really nice product. But I know some will deride their effort simply on the basis of them essentially going against Apple.
#6
ronhands
- Newbie
-
- Group: Members
- Posts: 1
- Joined: 08-May 08
Posted 08 May 2008 - 10:29 AM
Compare Price and Features - The real story
Psystar osx 2.66 with video, wireless g only and firewire upgrades. $894.99. No keyboard, no mouse, no monitor, no webcam, no mic, no ilife, no bluetooth, no speakers, no N wireless, no all-in-one design, smaller harddrive.
True Apple iMac 20" 2.66 $1,499 Worth every penny of the $505 difference.
Psystar osx 2.66 with video, wireless g only and firewire upgrades. $894.99. No keyboard, no mouse, no monitor, no webcam, no mic, no ilife, no bluetooth, no speakers, no N wireless, no all-in-one design, smaller harddrive.
True Apple iMac 20" 2.66 $1,499 Worth every penny of the $505 difference.
#7
the7ofswords
- Newbie
-
- Group: Members
- Posts: 12
- Joined: 05-March 07
Posted 08 May 2008 - 10:33 AM
The only good reason to buy one of these (or to build your own FrankenMac) is to get a better graphics card than you could otherwise.
If you just want a "casual user" machine, a low-end iMac or even a Mini will do the trick just fine, and for the same or slightly higher price - with the benefits of owning a legal and fully-supported Mac.
But the fact remains, if you are looking for a gaming machine without having to spend in the neighborhood of $2,000+ (not to mention suffering from the built-in obsolescence of non-upgradeable equipment), you still have to build or buy a Windows-based rig.
If Apple would offer the option of putting a decent video card into an affordable machine, these people would go out of business, because their market would disappear.
7
If you just want a "casual user" machine, a low-end iMac or even a Mini will do the trick just fine, and for the same or slightly higher price - with the benefits of owning a legal and fully-supported Mac.
But the fact remains, if you are looking for a gaming machine without having to spend in the neighborhood of $2,000+ (not to mention suffering from the built-in obsolescence of non-upgradeable equipment), you still have to build or buy a Windows-based rig.
If Apple would offer the option of putting a decent video card into an affordable machine, these people would go out of business, because their market would disappear.
7
#8
kresh
- Member
-
- Group: Members
- Posts: 222
- Joined: 11-October 05
Posted 08 May 2008 - 10:50 AM
Why is no one mentioning the lack of Wi-Fi and Bluetooth on these Psystar clones? Is it not important anymore? How about the Apple Remote that comes included with the Mac Mini and the iMac? Does this not count at all?
There is no way that I could live without the Wi-Fi internet connection and the Bluetooth mouse and keyboard for my Mac Mini. Both of these options are not available for the Psystar. According to some of the forum posts on OSX86 it's just not as simple as plugging in a USB WiFi or BT adaptor, most of them don't work.
And the little bitty, black hatted, white Apple remote! I use mine several times a day.
I'm serious. Why do all these reviewers skip over these things? It's all the little things that would make me want to spend the $20 - $30 more for the high end Mac Mini. Let's see you trade 28% speed for all the little things that really make the Mac awesome.
Mac Mini and the Wii FTW!
edit: ronhands beat me to it :p
Also one last thought. The Psystar seems to do really well because of the hard drive, according to comments made 5/7/08 Macworld Podcast. The Mac Mini does suffer from using a slow 2.5" drive.
I use the Internal Drive as a slice, a Firewire partition of the same size as a slice and a USB partition of the same size as a slice, all in a 3 Slice Raid 0 drive. Needless to say my Mac Mini smokes compared to a Mac Mini using just the internal drive. Here's the screen shot of Disk Utilities to show what I mean:
The other halves of the USB and Firewire drives I use for general storage. Mozy takes care of backing up all my drives in the background for $4.95 a month with unlimited storage and bandwidth!
There is no way that I could live without the Wi-Fi internet connection and the Bluetooth mouse and keyboard for my Mac Mini. Both of these options are not available for the Psystar. According to some of the forum posts on OSX86 it's just not as simple as plugging in a USB WiFi or BT adaptor, most of them don't work.
And the little bitty, black hatted, white Apple remote! I use mine several times a day.
I'm serious. Why do all these reviewers skip over these things? It's all the little things that would make me want to spend the $20 - $30 more for the high end Mac Mini. Let's see you trade 28% speed for all the little things that really make the Mac awesome.
Mac Mini and the Wii FTW!
edit: ronhands beat me to it :p
Also one last thought. The Psystar seems to do really well because of the hard drive, according to comments made 5/7/08 Macworld Podcast. The Mac Mini does suffer from using a slow 2.5" drive.
I use the Internal Drive as a slice, a Firewire partition of the same size as a slice and a USB partition of the same size as a slice, all in a 3 Slice Raid 0 drive. Needless to say my Mac Mini smokes compared to a Mac Mini using just the internal drive. Here's the screen shot of Disk Utilities to show what I mean:
The other halves of the USB and Firewire drives I use for general storage. Mozy takes care of backing up all my drives in the background for $4.95 a month with unlimited storage and bandwidth!
#9
Grapho
- Veteran
-
- Group: Members
- Posts: 1,936
- Joined: 30-August 04
Posted 08 May 2008 - 11:04 AM
[quote name='George76']
>
Nothing killer on the iLife suite? Then you follow your assumption with "the only one I use is iTunes", well there you have it, you don't use it, so you think it has no value? I could say the same thing about Microsoft Office, yet some depend a lot on it, even thou I don't use it much particularly, and it's of little value to me. Actually iLife has a lot more value to me then Office, but I am not going to write Office off just because I use it very little.
OS X has been designed by Apple for Apple hardware, just watch Apple release 10.5.3 only to leave all these adventures cheep Psystar customers holding an un-upgradable Mac. Hell they can still install Windows on them right?
>
jhorvatic said:
> No software support, no hardware support, no iLife suite. Those alone are worth the price of a Mac Mini even if it is a little slower. Not to mention Psystar is illegal. It will soon be a worthless paperweight sitting on someone's floor.
Sounds like there is some level of support based on the conversation with the Psystar rep mentioned in the article. There's really nothing killer in the iLife suite. The only one I use on a regular basis is iTunes and that can be had for free and I have very little use for iWeb or Garage Band.
I suppose it's in the questionable legality area violating the EULA, but I find it to be an interesting experiment. Sounds like if they were allowed to continue and grow they could turn out a really nice product. But I know some will deride their effort simply on the basis of them essentially going against Apple.
Sounds like there is some level of support based on the conversation with the Psystar rep mentioned in the article. There's really nothing killer in the iLife suite. The only one I use on a regular basis is iTunes and that can be had for free and I have very little use for iWeb or Garage Band.
I suppose it's in the questionable legality area violating the EULA, but I find it to be an interesting experiment. Sounds like if they were allowed to continue and grow they could turn out a really nice product. But I know some will deride their effort simply on the basis of them essentially going against Apple.
Nothing killer on the iLife suite? Then you follow your assumption with "the only one I use is iTunes", well there you have it, you don't use it, so you think it has no value? I could say the same thing about Microsoft Office, yet some depend a lot on it, even thou I don't use it much particularly, and it's of little value to me. Actually iLife has a lot more value to me then Office, but I am not going to write Office off just because I use it very little.
OS X has been designed by Apple for Apple hardware, just watch Apple release 10.5.3 only to leave all these adventures cheep Psystar customers holding an un-upgradable Mac. Hell they can still install Windows on them right?
#11
doctor sid
- Member
-
- Group: Members
- Posts: 15
- Joined: 14-December 07
Posted 08 May 2008 - 11:14 AM
Do some real test when you compare computers. Doing stuff that takes a few second (less than 2 minutes) is about as useless as letting gas in a empty room.
Open a 4GB photoshop file and run a filter. Or save a 15Gb Final cut pro movie. Or covert a 6 minute song to MP3. At least something that matters
Open a 4GB photoshop file and run a filter. Or save a 15Gb Final cut pro movie. Or covert a 6 minute song to MP3. At least something that matters
#12
macavenger
- Member
-
- Group: Members
- Posts: 46
- Joined: 05-February 08
Posted 08 May 2008 - 11:21 AM
{quote} It will soon be a worthless paperweight sitting on someone's floor {quote}
{quote}Pretty soon they're going to have to change their name to PsyBrick....{quote}
I would just like to point out that being illegal and unsupported (by Apple at least) and not being able to install OS updates in no way implies that the machine will, at some point, suddenly stop working. In fact, I would expect these machines to continue happily running the version of Mac OS X they came installed with for many years, until hardware components start failing. An inability to update the OS (which is also not necessarily the case here, although likely) does not a paperweight, or brick, make :)
{quote}Pretty soon they're going to have to change their name to PsyBrick....{quote}
I would just like to point out that being illegal and unsupported (by Apple at least) and not being able to install OS updates in no way implies that the machine will, at some point, suddenly stop working. In fact, I would expect these machines to continue happily running the version of Mac OS X they came installed with for many years, until hardware components start failing. An inability to update the OS (which is also not necessarily the case here, although likely) does not a paperweight, or brick, make :)
#13
Jim Galbraith
- Advanced Member
-
- Group: Macworld Editorial
- Posts: 45
- Joined: 13-December 00
Posted 08 May 2008 - 12:16 PM
Doctor Sid,
Most of our tests take a minute or more to complete on these systems. Some take up to 5 minutes. We already convert 45 minutes worth of music files to MP3 - that's one of the tests that comes in under the one minute mark.
We look at all of our tests when updating Speedmark and increase the file sizes and demands where we can. The problem is, you risk removing the "real world" aspect of the tests when testing with 4GB Photoshop files, for instance. That may be some people's real world work load, but they aren't shopping for Mac minis or low-end iMacs. Speedmark is our general use performance measurement tool for testing all Macs. Some of the tests you recommend make good sense for a Mac Pro, not so much for this set of computers.
Most of our tests take a minute or more to complete on these systems. Some take up to 5 minutes. We already convert 45 minutes worth of music files to MP3 - that's one of the tests that comes in under the one minute mark.
We look at all of our tests when updating Speedmark and increase the file sizes and demands where we can. The problem is, you risk removing the "real world" aspect of the tests when testing with 4GB Photoshop files, for instance. That may be some people's real world work load, but they aren't shopping for Mac minis or low-end iMacs. Speedmark is our general use performance measurement tool for testing all Macs. Some of the tests you recommend make good sense for a Mac Pro, not so much for this set of computers.
#14
MorrisTheCat
- Member
-
- Group: Members
- Posts: 476
- Joined: 14-December 07
Posted 08 May 2008 - 01:05 PM
kresh said:
Why is no one mentioning the lack of Wi-Fi and Bluetooth on these Psystar clones? Is it not important anymore? How about the Apple Remote that comes included with the Mac Mini and the iMac? Does this not count at all?
Not to mention the lack of an integrated camera that is included in the iMac models. I guess iChat video conferencing will be (mostly) out of the question with one of these. There are some supported external cameras, but they can be a serious PITA to get working.
Sorry, but as was mentioned above, the only reason I can see to get something like this is to build a gaming rig that could have an upgradable vidcard. Otherwise, its not worth the hassle. Get a genuine fully supported Mac. And I agree, if Apple decides to come out with an affordable, upgradable mid-range system, the market for Psystar will shrivel up overnight, even if said system was within $200 of their price.
