[Macworld]

Post your comments for iPhone App Store and Web apps a hit with users here

[MrYmath]

Yes a hit - unless you choose to return the iPhone before the AT&T contract becomes permanent after 30 days. So, if the 30 day period allows you do a live test of the phone, then it should also include testing those apps that are useful to the owner. Then when the phone is returned you're stuck with having paid for useless apps that will only work on an iPhone. Apple has made it clear that all sales are final, regardless of what happens to the phone. With each new product, the concept of "Customer Service" has become an oxymoron at Apple Inc.

[samkass]

You can try out plenty of the over 500 free apps. Or try a couple of the hundreds of apps that cost no more than a latte and you'll probably get your entertainment's dollar worth in the time you have your phone. If that's your biggest complaint, then Apple really is doing well.

[melgross]

MrYmath, why are you even to bother with that troll? You really believe that there are many people returning their phones?
You're setting up a straw man, and you know it.
Perhaps you should get over it, and at least try the phone.

[Gee4orce]

Er - so if I buy an iPod and return it, I should expect a refund for any music I bought for it ? If I buy a Mac and return it, I should get a refund for any applications I installed ? If I buy a car and return it, I get a refund for the petrol ?

Don't be silly.

[Wondercow]

MrYmath said:

Yes a hit - unless you choose to return the iPhone before the AT&T contract becomes permanent after 30 days. So, if the 30 day period allows you do a live test of the phone, then it should also include testing those apps that are useful to the owner. Then when the phone is returned you're stuck with having paid for useless apps that will only work on an iPhone. Apple has made it clear that all sales are final, regardless of what happens to the phone. With each new product, the concept of "Customer Service" has become an oxymoron at Apple Inc.

If you make long-distance calls AT&T won't refund that cost will they? Why not? They should since you can't properly evaluate the iPhone without testing the call quality.

Every day I see more and more evidence of just how me-centric society is becoming. Waaaa! I could have tried free apps but I paid for some instead. Waaaa! I was clearly notified that there are no refunds but I want a refund. Waaaa! I bought something from a third-party and the first-party won't give me my money back.

[MrYmath]

When you buy music online, you can play it from itunes on a computer. You don't need an ipod. When you buy computer software, you can use it on another computer. The petrol analogy is nonsense since I paid for AT&T usage for the three weeks I had the iPhone. Using over 500 free titles, as one reader suggested is irrelevant since most of those apps are irrelevant for serious purposes (check out the app store - the number doesn't even come close). However, buying an app for the iPhone is only useful if you keep your iPhone. So if my vendor, Apple, accepted my phone return and gave me a full refund, and if my vendor, again Apple, accepted my iPhone case return and gave me a full refund, then perhaps my vendor, again Apple, should also give me a full refund for those apps which I had to buy to make the iPhone a usable tool for me. Especially since they are the only vendor for these apps.

[themagicguy3]

I love my iPhone. I am not in a 3G area, but the edge is working well. I have not had too many drop calls. On my sprint phone I had more dropped calls then turning to AT&T.
MrYmath, I agree that you should get a refund, but only if the program does not work. I am sure they has the same policies for music if the download becomes corrupted or not working after downloading, but why would someone buy apps known they are going to have the phone for 30 days? I thought the idea behind the trial period is to see if the phone will work in your area and one would be happy with it. Sure, you would like to play some games and test different apps, and there are tons of free games and utilities that will use everything the phone has to offer. If you have the mind set that"Hey, I am going to return his phone" then you should not pay for apps, your loss.

[MrYmath]

The point that I'm trying to make which some folks just don't get is that the "program" consists of three distinct parts - the iPhone, AT&T and the apps store. In the US, the iPhone cannot work without AT&T and would not have had the impact it has without the apps store. They are distinct, but conjoined. The whole is only as good as its weakest link. Knowing all of this in advance (there were no surprises) I bought it, liked it and had every intention of keeping it had it not been for the far-less-than reliable AT&T service. I had been with Verizon for 5 years and have had 3 different phones. I've had clear reception wherever I've needed it with not even a single dropped call. If the iPhone was available on Verizon, it would have been great. With all of the product ads, I expected no less from AT&T. But if I can't even get a signal in my own house, within a solid 3G region, then...
So the program consists of the iPhone, with a 14 day return policy (except with manager approval), AT&T with a 30 day no commitment policy and the apps store with a no return policy. Didn't anyone at Apple think this through before the program was created? And did no one care about the impact on the clients?

[chewygoat]

The AppStore is good, the apps are good, but the 2.0 firmware is a disaster pretty much. Periodically 3rd party apps stop loading. In some cases you can power off an on and it fixes it... for a while. In other cases that doesn't work. In some of those cases you can install a new app and magically your other apps will start working again... for a while. Of course if you aren't on a WiFi network when you need to launch SplashID in order to look up a password and SplashID won't launch and powering off and on doesn't help... you're screwed. Then even in some of those cases, installing a new app doesn't help. In that case you can try doing an hours-long restore and setup from backup and copy all your music and apps back again. Sometimes this works. Unfortunately, as I've found out twice now, sometimes it doesn't. In that case the only solution is to do a restore and set up as a new iPod, losing all of your app data in the process. I have had start the RPG game Vay over twice. I'm now back at the beginning again and I'm not going to bother playing it again until I see some evidence that this problem has been truly resolved. Apple's promising a fix in September. I sincerely hope it works, because the 2.0 firmware is barely alpha quality and shouldn't have been released.

[samkass]

MrYmath, I think Apple is very committed to the clients, it's simply that your complaint is not very high on anyone's problem list. You obviously feel strongly about it, so maybe the iPhone just isn't for you. If you're going to worry about a couple of bucks spent on applications, perhaps there is a nice Treo for you (that lets you rent ring tones for a non-refundable $3/month).

[Wondercow]

MrYmath said:

When you buy computer software, you can use it on another computer.

Right. And the apps you purchased can be used on another phone. Unless your point is that you didn't keep ANY iPhone, in which case the computer analogy stands because Mac software won't run on Windows.

[sheilanolan]

I am a big fan of the apps and check for new free one every day. Now, if only I could use those apps for more than a couple of days before the whole thing crashes and I have to pretty much start over again, I'd be really happy.

[Damn_Its_Hot]

Some of these neat 3rd party apps at the App Store are buggy as hell. I suspect that they can cause problems for the rest of your iPhone (I suspect that most of the vetting that Apple does is to check for these kind of things). I don't know for sure since I have not written an IPhone App yet but I would be very surprised to find that 3rd party apps can't cause some type of corruption.