[Macworld]

Post your comments for Premiere leads the changes to Adobe?s video apps here

[lin2log]

Seriously... who uses Premiere or any of the Adobe video apps (other than AE of course) on the MAC??
Outside of AE I don't see why someone, who isn't e.g. a switcher that's too stubborn or chicken to learn a few new things for the switch to FCP, would see any advantage in using Premiere. Other than the Speech Search thing (which I could buy Audition for for $199, should I actually need it), there is not one "new" feature listed that hasn't been in Final Cut Studio for a long time. They've always been behind and even when they DO catch up, it's nowhere near as well implemented as it is in FCP (i.e. multiclip editing). But then, considering that FCP is from Randy Ubillos, former developer of Premiere (ah, the irony), I guess that's not all that big of a surprise.
I was in fact rather surprised that Adobe even decided to go Mac again, seeing that they have more than lost the fight to Final Cut Studio and that years ago. And for good reason if you ask me.
I'm a video professional and don't even know of any PC users that use Premiere in production. I seriously wonder which money they're paying the video dev-team with. Acrobat money?
Oh well. I guess for the sake of SOME sort of competition it's okay. But I hardly doubt Apple sees the Adobe apps as any type of threat or real competition.

[mistersquid]

@lin2log: Audition doesn't exist for the Mac.

[lin2log]

I of course meant Soundbooth.

[eaddison]

I'm a PC user, and a long time Premiere editor. I know quite a few other editors who are the same as me. And for the record, I also use and know FCP.

Have you even used the current or last version of PPro? And as for catching up, I think Adobe as led in the past with a number of features (i.e. Dynaimc Link, Clip Notes, etc.), and with it's native editing of XDCAM, P2, and RED, it's ahead of FCP with it's need to transcode to QT. PPro is the one to watch. Don't just dimiss it so easily.

I'm not going to knock FCP - it's a great NLE. But I think many of it's editors fail to really see what some of the other NLE's can do.

[mcdonkeyboy]

around 35% of Production Premium's sales are on the Mac.

[gballey]

I have a friend who is in independent video producer, including commercial work and entertainment video for cruise lines. He switched to Mac a year or two ago and uses the Final Cut suite, but has had to purchase the Adobe software so that he can author Blue Ray discs. He thinks its crazy that Apple doesn't offer Blue Ray support yet.

[lin2log]

eaddison said:

I'm a PC user, and a long time Premiere editor.

Exactly what I said. Which explains it. And you may have noticed I was speaking specifically about Premiere on the Mac. The fact that Premiere is possibly the best NLE on the PC I don't doubt for a minute.

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I know quite a few other editors who are the same as me.

Of which none are on the Mac, right? Gettin' my point?

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Have you even used the current or last version of PPro?

Sorry, but I in fact worked for Adobe up until a couple of years ago. Just before they brought PP back to the Mac. So whilst I may not know the newest version in terrible detail, I think I may generally even know it better than you, yes.

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And as for catching up, I think Adobe as led in the past with a number of features (i.e. Dynaimc Link, Clip Notes, etc.),

:-D Nice little add-ons, yes, but truly not feature's that PROS miss in anyway. Aside from having the same functionality elsewhere (if actually needed), if not directly within FCP. And that each software package has some sort of feature or extra that the other doesn't is a given. But pros care about the whole enchilada, not which has a longer list of nifty extra's.

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and with it's native editing of XDCAM, P2, and RED, it's ahead of FCP with it's need to transcode to QT.

Ouch. Sorry, but that was embarrassingly wrong on multiple levels. FCP has supported the aforementioned formats nearly TWO YEARS longer than PP. You might want to actually read the article you're commenting on, since it says itsself that PP only NOW, with CS4, actually supports those formats the way you claim it has. FCP already supported them with version FIVE, sorry.

And sorry, you might want to brush up on your knowledge about QT and how it handles these formats, since there is ZERO transcoding involved. FCP works with the formats in their native format, they are merely placed within a QT wrapper.

PPro is the one to watch. Don't just dimiss it so easily.

I very much have been watching it, which is exactly why I wrote the comment.

I'm not going to knock FCP - it's a great NLE. But I think many of it's editors fail to really see what some of the other NLE's can do.

I've been an editor for nearly 20 years, am a consultant on the subject and have truly seen and worked them all, in addition to many I'm sure you've never even heard of. I'm very confidant that I very much know what I'm talking about.

As I said before, Randy Ubillos essentially made FCP what he wished PP could have been, only Adobe wouldn't go for it. Their bad.

l2l

[lin2log]

mcdonkeyboy said:

around 35% of Production Premium's sales are on the Mac.

:-D
Yeah, and guess what? I bought it too. Which is a complete no-brainer, considering that After Effects, Photoshop Extended, Flash AND Illustrator are in the package also! Ever taken the time to figure out how much those would cost you if you bought them separately??!! Even just TWO of them??

So to think or suggest that that in some way could mean 35% of Premiere users are on the Mac... is horribly misguided, sorry.

l2l

[lin2log]

gballey said:

but has had to purchase the Adobe software so that he can author Blue Ray discs.

Too bad. You could have simply sent him the link to Taost 9 and saved him a LOT of money. But him not actually knowing how to author BDMV on a Mac is hardly Apple's fault, sorry. But I admit it's a easy excuse.

[mcdonkeyboy]

Wow, you really are an angry elf lin2log. [~51340]

[gballey]

bq. lin2log wrote: Too bad. You could have simply sent him the link to Taost 9 and saved him a LOT of money. But him not actually knowing how to author BDMV on a Mac is hardly Apple's fault, sorry. But I admit it's a easy excuse.
He knows about Toast's ability to encode and burn Blue Ray discs. But the menu and layout options are pretty limited.

[lin2log]

mcdonkeyboy said:

Wow, you really are an angry elf lin2log. [~51340]

lol... yeah, and you quite obviously just ran out of any real or grown-up arguments. But then again, you probably just realized you never really had any, eh? But at least I'm starting to understand your choice of nick much better, thanks.

Grow up.

[eaddison]

Well, to begin - I do know a couple editors who use PPro on Mac. True that most are on PC, but not all.

As for you working for Adobe and knowing PPro - I don't know you, and I don't know what you did at Adobe, so I'm not going to get into an arguement about who knows what. What I do know is that I edit with PPro on almost a daily basis, so I'm speaking as a user with lots of experience with it. And as someone who cuts with FCP on occassion as well.

As for the features, I'd consider Dynamic Link with AE more then a nice little add-on. If you use AE at all, it's a great feature. And we've had it for the past 2 versions now...FCP got something similar in their latest release if I'm not mistaken. Photoshop integration - FCP doesn't have the same quality - sorry, it doesn't. Can you name me 2 additional tools that are more widely used by editors then those? I'm not going to do a list of features between PPro and FCP because they are both very similar. As for the "whole enchilada", you're right - it's the total package. But can you honestly say the FCS is as complete a package as the Adobe Suite? Motion is good, but it's not AE. Color is great, but could be better integrated.

Ouch. Sorry, but that was embarrassingly wrong on multiple levels. FCP has supported the aforementioned formats nearly TWO YEARS longer than PP. You might want to actually read the article you're commenting on, since it says itsself that PP only NOW, with CS4, actually supports those formats the way you claim it has. FCP already supported them with version FIVE, sorry.

With the exception of RED, PPro has had support for those formats since CS3 - so I'm not wrong about that. AVCHD native support is new however. While it's true FCP has had it longer, are you telling me that the abilty to pull the files right from the P2 or SxS card (or XDCAM disc) and drop them right onto the timeline - without wrapping it as something else isn't better then the way FCP handles it? The way it's always been explained to me was Final Cut Pro does not work with MXF natively. Instead it unwraps the MXF data and rewraps it in Quicktime during the import process. So maybe transcode was the wrong word to use - sorry. But when it comes to AVCHD, transcode would be the word to use - FCP has to convert to ProRes (or something else) in order to edit that footage. Oh, and I did read the article, thank you.

As I said, I don't know you - you say you've been an editor for 20 years. Okay, good for you. I've been working in film/video production business for almost 15. I've worked with just about all the NLEs, and I go back to the Video Toaster (UGH!). I'm not questioning your knowledge. I've just found that many Mac and FCP users are these almost relgious-like zealots who think that FCP is the end-all, be-all. Avid, FCP, PPro, Vegas - what ever you use, it's a tool. It's what you do with the tool. You don't ask the guy who works on your car what kind of tools he uses, you just want him to do a great job.

For some people, FCP allows them to do their best, for others PPro - they both have good points and things that need to be improved.