[Macworld]

Post your comments for Eddy Winner: Logitech diNovo Edge Mac Edition keyboard here

[heimdall]

Hm. I don't know if this is a testament to the lack of competition in good keyboards these days.
It's a decent enough keyboard--and by that I mean, just the feel of the keys themselves.
The TouchDIsc, though, is a joke. The volume slider is useless if you use external speakers--the Mac's volume controls are disabled and the slider can't be remapped to control application (iTunes, DVD Player, etc.) volume instead.
The Logitech software doesn't support disabling Caps Lock, and conflicts with OS X's Keyboard and Mouse pref pane, which does.
And... no number pad.
Decent keyboard, yes. Winner? No way.

[MorrisTheCat]

I was thinking the same thing. Yeah, this is a cool keyboard, but it has too many drawbacks for me to consider it. The lack of a Number pad is a deal killer for me.
It is indeed a sad statement to how poor the Mac 3rd party keyboard market is right now that this is the Eddy award winner.
Although I suspect if Logitech's recently announced diNovo Mac keyboard (not the Edge) was actually available at the time they were writing all this up, it may have taken this award instead, as that one has a full sized keyboard in the same general styling as the Edge and removes the useless touchdisk, etc. If only it was Bluetooth instead of RF with a dongle, I'd be all over that keyboard.

[heimdall]

I also thought the "non-Edge" diiNovo looked interesting, but, OTOH, thought that, perhaps, they'd made too many changes in order to differentiate it.

It also doesn't have the Edge's rechargeable battery. The specs say "Three-year battery life minimizes the hassle of changing batteries. A flashing battery-indicator light alerts you when your batteries are low."
OK, then what? What sort of batteries does it use, and are they user-serviceable?

I don't know why they went for RF--doesn't it cost them more to have a transmitter/receiver in the keyboard, AND the USB dongle. The Edge doesn't come with a Bluetooth adapter (at least, I don't recall seeing one in the box).

Still, when I saw the new keyboard's number pad, that sold me. I've given up on the TouchDisc as being too impractical, the media keys don't usually seem to DO anything (do they only work with Front Row and not iTunes? I never use Front Row). I've yet to find a use for the left-click button.

I'd be curious to compare the home/end, pageup/pagedown key configurations to other keyboards. I find their placement on the Edge odd and hard to get used to, at least compared to they keyboards I'm used to.

[Dan Frakes]

heimdall said:

The TouchDIsc, though, is a joke.

As I noted in our review, the touchpad isn't as useful as it could be, and it's not a substitute for a dedicated pointing device. But it's convenient if you use your Mac in a home entertainment system or if you occasionally want to lean back from your desk and still have mouse control. Still, the touchpad's limited usefulness was what kept the Edge from getting our highest rating.

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The volume slider is useless if you use external speakers--the Mac's volume controls are disabled and the slider can't be remapped to control application (iTunes, DVD Player, etc.) volume instead.

I use external speakers and I use the Edge's volume control; it's identical to using the volume up/down keys on any other Mac-compatible keyboard, including Apple's. (And on most Mac keyboards, the volume keys are hardware-based, so you can't reassign them to do anything else.) Maybe I'm not understanding you here, but I don't get how the slider is useless, or how it disables the Mac's own volume controls.

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The Logitech software doesn't support disabling Caps Lock, and conflicts with OS X's Keyboard and Mouse pref pane, which does.

I just tested this, and if you set Caps Lock to No Action in OS X's Keyboard prefs, it works perfectly. Caps Lock never engages, the Edge's caps-lock indicator never lights, etc. What problem have you had?

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And... no number pad.

After reviewing nearly a dozen keyboards over the past year, I've come to the conclusion that a numeric keypad is a personal preference, not something vital. (And I say that as someone who uses a numeric keypad every day if it's there.) Some people need it, others don't. And not having a numeric keypad has considerable ergonomic benefits.

If you like the diNovo Edge except for the touchpad and volume slider, check out the just-released diNovo Mac (non-Edge). Great keyboard for less money (although it has a horrible F-key layout and it's missing Bluetooth and a rechargeable battery).

[Dan Frakes]

heimdall said:

I also thought the "non-Edge" diiNovo looked interesting...
I don't know why they went for RF--doesn't it cost them more to have a transmitter/receiver in the keyboard, AND the USB dongle. The Edge doesn't come with a Bluetooth adapter (at least, I don't recall seeing one in the box).

From what vendors have told me, Bluetooth is indeed more expensive. (And, in fact, the reason the diNovo Edge for Mac is $20 less than the Windows version is because all current Macs have built-in Bluetooth, so Logitech didn't need to include the dongle.) The other factor is likely that RF means Logitech can offer a diNovo model for older (non-Bluetooth) Macs while making that model more affordable.

(It's also worth noting that Bluetooth isn't inherently better than RF.)

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I'd be curious to compare the home/end, pageup/pagedown key configurations to other keyboards. I find their placement on the Edge odd and hard to get used to, at least compared to they keyboards I'm used to.

Agreed. I noted that in my review of the Edge. The non-Edge diNovo uses a standard layout.

[heimdall]

Dan Frakes said:

I use external speakers and I use the Edge's volume control; it's identical to using the volume up/down keys on any other Mac-compatible keyboard, including Apple's. (And on most Mac keyboards, the volume keys are hardware-based, so you can't reassign them to do anything else.) Maybe I'm not understanding you here, but I don't get how the slider is useless, or how it disables the Mac's own volume controls.

I didn't say the keyboard disables the controls, just that my controls are disabled. Perhaps it depends on how the speakers are attached. I have a 5.1 speaker system connected via Digital Out, which disables the Output volume control. That is, when Sound preference pane>Output is switched from Internal Speakers to Digital Out, the Output volume slider in the pane (and the slider in the menu bar, if so enabled) greys out and cannot be moved. As a result, I always use the application's volume control to change the setting (though my speaker system's control unit also has a separate volume control).

I note this as a problem because of how much room is devoted to the volume slider. If the media keys at far left had been placed along the top, the same sized keyboard could have accommodated a number pad--after getting this keyboard I finally realized how much I rely on it. For that matter, I suppose the volume slider could also have been placed at top, horizontally.

Output volume can be varied by software (you can do it by AppleScript), so I imagine this could have been switchable, if they'd designed it so.

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I just tested this, and if you set Caps Lock to No Action in OS X's Keyboard prefs, it works perfectly. Caps Lock never engages, the Edge's caps-lock indicator never lights, etc. What problem have you had?

Interesting. On my system, when Caps Lock is set to No Action, if Caps Lock is pressed, the indicator light on the keyboard lights up (and the keyboard beeps), though caps are not typed. The light will not go off unless I re-enable Caps Lock in Keyboard prefs. I had called Logitech about this before posting, and the rep basically shrugged and said that this was Apple's fault. Guess he never bothered to check if this was a replicable issue. He said that they had intentionally left this function out of the Logitech Control Center software and kept trying to talk over me when I asked why the LCC software didn't let the OS's functionality work.

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If you like the diNovo Edge except for the touchpad and volume slider, check out the just-released diNovo Mac (non-Edge). Great keyboard for less money (although it has a horrible F-key layout and it's missing Bluetooth and a rechargeable battery).

Yes, I posted about this (above). I'm looking at the picture of they keyboard on Logitech's site. What don't you like about the F-key layout? The most obvious thing I see is that I'd prefer the Eject key be on the far right, outside of the pack. Aside from that, I much prefer the diNovo's (non-Edge; what confusing naming!) home/end, pageup/pagedown layout. Much more standardized. When I saw the announcement, I wish I'd had waited--I think, on balance, I prefer the newer keyboard.

[heimdall]

Dan Frakes said:

(It's also worth noting that Bluetooth isn't inherently better than RF.)

DIdn't say it was. But using BT meant one less thing to occupy my mess of USB connections. I have two seven-connector USB hubs, both full. When a device has a USB conflict it's a headache to diagnose.

[Dan Frakes]

heimdall said:

I didn't say the keyboard disables the controls, just that my controls are disabled. Perhaps it depends on how the speakers are attached. I have a 5.1 speaker system connected via Digital Out, which disables the Output volume control. That is, when Sound preference pane>Output is switched from Internal Speakers to Digital Out, the Output volume slider in the pane (and the slider in the menu bar, if so enabled) greys out and cannot be moved. As a result, I always use the application's volume control to change the setting (though my speaker system's control unit also has a separate volume control).

Ah, that makes much more sense -- the optical-digital audio output is either on or off; there is no volume level in the signal. The issue for you seems to be that Logitech mapped the slider to hardware volume controls, so the slider sends the same signals as the Volume Up and Down keys on Apple's keyboards. In general, I think this is the best way to do it, but I see your point.

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> I just tested this, and if you set Caps Lock to No Action in OS X's Keyboard prefs, it works perfectly. Caps Lock never engages, the Edge's caps-lock indicator never lights, etc. What problem have you had?

Interesting. On my system, when Caps Lock is set to No Action, if Caps Lock is pressed, the indicator light on the keyboard lights up (and the keyboard beeps), though caps are not typed. The light will not go off unless I re-enable Caps Lock in Keyboard prefs. I had called Logitech about this before posting, and the rep basically shrugged and said that this was Apple's fault.

I would contact them again and tell them that you know it can work because other people have tested it ;)

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> If you like the diNovo Edge except for the touchpad and volume slider, check out the just-released diNovo Mac (non-Edge). Great keyboard for less money (although it has a horrible F-key layout and it's missing Bluetooth and a rechargeable battery).

Yes, I posted about this (above). I'm looking at the picture of they keyboard on Logitech's site. What don't you like about the F-key layout? The most obvious thing I see is that I'd prefer the Eject key be on the far right, outside of the pack. Aside from that, I much prefer the diNovo's (non-Edge; what confusing naming!) home/end, pageup/pagedown layout. Much more standardized. When I saw the announcement, I wish I'd had waited--I think, on balance, I prefer the newer keyboard.

The traditional -- and IMO, more usable -- layout is for the F-keys to be grouped in four-key pods and placed separate from the main key area. Mashing all the F-keys in a continuous row flush against the top of the main key area makes it more difficult to find the desired F-key by touch; it also makes it easy to overshoot the numeric row and hit an F-key accidentally. It's odd that Logitech did this with the diNovo, when the diNovo Edge and the Illuminated Keyboard (a Windows keyboard that is very similar to the diNovo) both have a proper F-key layout.