[jamus]

Yeah, no kidding. The reason I have an iPod Touch instead of an iPhone is not because I could not afford the purchase price. I just refuse to get locked into a 24 month contract at at least $70 a month. Not gonna happen. I talk very little on a cell and would love a "pay as you go" iPhone plan without any cell data services. WiFi is fine with me.

[hayesk]

palane said:

"Apple’s not going to make cut-rate versions of its—let’s not forget, super-successful—product to appeal to the masses."

You mean, like the iPod Shuffle or Mini? What were those products if not an attempt to sell iPods to people at lower price points?

You are confusing cut-rate with inexpensive. Cut-rate is trying to shoehorn functionality into a smaller cheaper device making the entire quality/usability of the device suffer.

Companies making tiny MP3 players with tiny screens that are too small to read is cut-rate. Designing a small device that doesn't try to have all of the functionality of a larger one makes more sense, like the shuffle.

[hayesk]

Kromm said:

I for one would love to be able to buy the iPhone without a data plan. I don't need the ability to search the web everywhere I am. Most places I go have wi-fi anyway so that is why I bought the iPod Touch. No monthly charges. If I could get the iPhone without a data plan I would have one instead of my Touch.

I agree there is a market for that, but let's be honest - it's small. Most people don't have Wi-Fi wherever they go, and this is a device intended to be always available. It's not really a market that makes sense to pursue.

I don't know about the US, but people in Canada have managed to get no-data plans. It involves negotiation with customer service but it is possible. You end up paying about $600 for the phone though (don't expect to get the subsidized $199 price) after purchasing and cancelling the data plan. You also have to get the phone company to actually cut off the data too - otherwise you acidentally hit Safari on the phone and boom - you get a big data charge.

[BearsFan34]

hayesk said:

I agree there is a market for that, but let's be honest - it's small. Most people don't have Wi-Fi wherever they go,

In my opinion, this is an underestimation. Speaking not just from personal experience alone, I've read other accounts on both the internet and have heard in meetings/groups that on the whole, at least in the part of the US where I live, wifi is pretty much ubiquitous. AAMOF, I know some folks that LOVE the iPhone, but couldn't afford the data plan...so now they carry 2 devices, the iPod touch and a "throw away" cell phone.

That's too tedious for me...and for my wife, who fits in the category of "wifi is everywhere." Every place she shops, every family members' home she/we visit, every "big box" (Target, with a Starbucks inside=free wifi) retailer...they all have free wifi. Maybe we have boring lives, but we don't travel; and wherever we go, when it's needed, wifi is available. Honestly, I can't think of one time in recent memory when she/we were out with her iPhone and lamented that there wasn't anyplace nearby with wifi.

So I take a slight issue with the "Most people don't have wifi wherever they go."

Actually, yes, a lot of people DO have it wherever they go...hence my decision to jailbreak/unlock the original iPhone & have it be used as just a phone AND a wifi device. Why pay more per month for a data plan (EDGE or 3G) that won't be used, literally, ever? That's why I take issue with this article; there IS a group of folks out there that do want to use the iPhone as a phone and wifi device, but not with a pricey data plan. It's just too bad it takes a little more technically-minded person (like me) to figure out how to use a data-less iPhone legitimately on a paid account. I join others in this discussion who advocate different pricing options, and just more options in general on the part of AT&T/wireless carriers. Doing so sure would save me the time & effort it takes to jailbreak/etc.

[Dan Moren]

context said:

Quote

It turns out, Dan, that while you are doing your sneering jerk routine, at least a small sampling of Mac devotees disagrees with your assessment.

You're free to disagree with my assessment?you'll notice the piece is marked as "opinion." But really, name-calling? Come now.

[orgopete]

[quote name='hayesk']
>

Kromm said:

> I for one would love to be able to buy the iPhone without a data plan. I don't need the ability to search the web everywhere I am. Most places I go have wi-fi anyway so that is why I bought the iPod Touch. No monthly charges. If I could get the iPhone without a data plan I would have one instead of my Touch.
>
I agree there is a market for that, but let's be honest - it's small. Most people don't have Wi-Fi wherever they go, and this is a device intended to be always available. It's not really a market that makes sense to pursue.

I don't agree. I am not a technophile, so I could be quite wrong here. The internet and digital voice are all really just data, but formatted differently(?). That has led to a pricing structure. I think the resistance is to the pricing structure.

Telephones used to be a wire-to-wire direct analog connection. Now, Verizon is delivering voice, data, and TV over the same (fiber optic) cable. They have bundled all of this data into a single pricing structure. I think what we are discussing and experiencing is an evolving technological market. The people at Apple are trying to do clever things to get you to keep them employed. The people at AT&T have joined into that model.

What we are noticing is that this marketing model and the rest of the world is not static. Apple's iron grip on the iPhone is not as strong in other countries. GSM systems are a lot more competitive in Europe and they enforce it. In the US, the CDMA systems really don't compete in the same way as other countries. It isn't like you can change sim cards and now you joined a competitor. I don't expect Apple/AT&T is going to voluntarily think they should reduce the package price because the customers are paying too much and their profits are too high. I can imagine if T-Mobile, for example, can bleed off customers with one of their plans, then Apple/AT&T can decide how to meet that competitive challenge. If someone thinks, "You know, lets just bundle them together." Then it will just become data. Skype competes because voice is just cheap data to send anyway? Can't the phone companies just use voice over the internet ala Skype anyway?

Unlocking the iPhone is also competitive pressure. As many of you may argue, this is also a marketing opportunity, I agree. That also will probably impact Apple's AT&T deal. I don't have a crystal ball and I don't expect a phone call from Apple for my opinion either.

[EPonj]

Far away from me is the idea of calling you names, Dan, but I didn't see the 'opinion' mark (still can't find it but it's not important either)

Back to the story:

Like most intervenants I think it could make sense to have an iPhone without data plan. The iPhone is a phone, music player, pda and internet communicator through Wifi or 3G/EDGE. Everybody uses it as they want to and noone is forced to use every feature of it.

Now, the solution is more in AT&T's hands than in Apple's (except for the exclusivity contract). There is no need to make a special iPhone for no-data plans. The actual one would be just fine. People who say it's silly to want an iPhone without data plan just selfishly think everybody should do like them because they're soooo high above the plebs.

Having the opportunity to access internet through 3G/EDGE is just one feature of the phone, and obviously not the most important one for a lot of people. Just like when you buy a car with a big engine doesn't mean you have to drive it at 120mph.

[wardoggie]

Congrats, Dan. Looks like you hit upon this year's "mythical midrange mac" :)

When I first read this article, I tended to agree that an iPhone without cellular data service isn't an iPhone anymore. It changes the experience tremendously. But after reading the numerous posts, I wonder if there isn't some kind of middle ground?

I see a lot of similarities between this discussion and the one about "why doesn't the iPod have an FM radio?" Perhaps the answer is a dock accessory that has a mic, SIM card slot and a cellular radio? Of course, when Apple finally responded with the FM radio attachment, I don't think it sold as well as people thought it would, so this might suffer the same fate. But if the data plan is truly a stumbling block for so many people, how many (especially those who already have iPod touches) would purchase such an accessory?

[kronos46]

Just to add.
I have an iPod touch. Since having it I would love to get the iPhone. The only thing holding me back is the data plan. $30./month is to high for internet on a phone (which I had on my cell and did not use). I do service work at cell phone sites. So I know where the major carriers are. AT&T is much larger in the Northeast than any other carrier. All the majors have the 3G network, and with talking to the cell techs the network is not that fast and reliable. So why pay for something that is not that reliable. I do use the internet at work via a laptop & an air card. I only access the internet when I am not at work from home. AT&T is the main reason for requiring the data plan NOT Apple. I have been told you can discontinue the data plan after your rebate clears. So I will check into this when my current carrier contract is up. But to force consumers to a $30/m data plan on top of the normal plan is DISTASTEFUL to say the least. Most carries require a minimum 2 yr contract so why not change it to 3 yrs. with no data plan.

[jinx101]

This article's got it wrong. First, An iPhone without the phone.... is an iPod touch. It already exists minus the camera/microphone (and, you can buy a microphone for it and make voIP calls). As a PDA, it works very well. I adore my corporate Exchange account and the iPod Touch connects with it well. The only downside is the stranglehold Apple keeps over what gets on it which makes it difficult to develop for corporate customers.

Personally, I dislike AT&T enough that I won't be getting a real iPhone is the foreseeable future until I can get one for Verizon.

[cat4ever]

"and, you can buy a microphone for it and make voIP calls)"

I have to take issue with this. Have you actually tried to use it for this? What I've tried isn't even close to usable.



Jeff

[meta]

I think Dan Moren is the one who's out of touch. The market research I've seen shows that the iPhone sells mostly to the low end of the market. It appeals to the people who previously bought Motorola RAZR phones; they don't care about data or e-mail or the web, they just want the latest cool-looking phone.
Let's face it, if the iPhone audience was mostly net folks it wouldn't have been a hit, given the lack of IM and MMS.

[orgopete]

meta said:

I think Dan Moren is the one who's out of touch. The market research I've seen shows that the iPhone sells mostly to the low end of the market. It appeals to the people who previously bought Motorola RAZR phones; they don't care about data or e-mail or the web, they just want the latest cool-looking phone.

Let's face it, if the iPhone audience was mostly net folks it wouldn't have been a hit, given the lack of IM and MMS.

Wow, just think how successful Apple could be if they only consulted the right people. When will they ever learn?

[chrisgalen]

It's really about costs. I've had Verizon for ten years. My monthly costs have gone down every year. I get a free phone every two years. There is no 3G access anywhere near me. I never walk around listening to my iPod, can't stand shutting out the world like that. I much prefer speakers over headphones. The interface is the selling point of the iPhone. Not the 3G whatever garbage. If I could get an iPhone without paying those extra costs per month I'd would. Why would I want to be constantly connected anyway?