Sign In
Register
Help
'No, my point stands, you just don't want to address it. You made the point that 67 billion tracks were stolen with the idea that somehow Qtrax was going to cash in on that market. Again, how is Qtrax going to monetize those 67 billion tracks?
I tried to explain that as an end user, a clean interface that offers millions of free songs from the four major labels, is much more attractive to me than surfing through sites that encourage illegal downloading. Surfing to find music is only attractive if the music itself is hard to find. I don't want to deal with broken links and sites that offer porn on the same page. Is it so hard for you to understand that concept? I used to use limewire, but that too is nowhere close as nice and user friendly as Qtrax. I can understand if you are a hardcore ipod user, Qtrax won't be for you for now. But how about everyone else that doesn't use I-pods. Sounds like a cash cow right there to me. Don't be a snob pal, we have known each other for over 2 hours now, that almost constitutes a relationship in these fast moving times. You are going to see, a lot of people will be interested in a free library larger than I-tunes
Qtrax shows how to make free, legal music downloads unappealing
MultiQuote
#72
ItunesIsDead 
- Newbie
-
- Group: Members
- Posts: 10
- Joined: 12-February 09
Posted 12 February 2009 - 08:27 PM
Chris, do you REALLY mean to tell us that after all your ranting and raving about how bad Qtrax is, that you haven't downloaded the Beta and TRIED THE PRODUCT ????!!!!! Man, you just toasted everything you have written! You haven't a clue what it looks like or how it works!
As for being tethered, you apparently aren't a good reader (or at least a selective reader). THIS WILL BE PORTABLE to a WIDE variety of MP3 players (not iPod, but this is Apple's decision, NOT Qtrax's) and many cell phones and other portable devices. How is that TETHERED?!
And when I said the iTunes/iPod was a closed system, I meant that you can't use another MP3 player with iTunes, and you can't use the iPod with any other music management systems. That, my friend, is a CLOSED, PROPRIETARY system. And whoever said that AAC was a DRM-free encoding technology was WRONG. AAC is in fact a coding system, but it is OPTIONAL if it is encoded with DRM or not. You see, Apple's own FairPlay DRM is in fact in AAC files. Every iTunes song is an AAC Protected song.
Here's a short summary for your reading pleasure:
"FairPlay is a digital rights management (DRM) technology created by Apple Inc., based on technology created by the company Veridisc. FairPlay is built into the QuickTime multimedia software and used by the iPhone, iPod, iTunes, and iTunes Store and the App Store. Any protected song or other form of media purchased from the iTunes Store with iTunes is encoded with FairPlay. FairPlay digitally encrypts AAC audio files and prevents users from playing these files on unauthorized computers.
How it works
FairPlay-protected files are regular MP4 container files with an encrypted AAC audio stream. The audio stream is encrypted using the AES algorithm in combination with MD5 hashes. The master key required to decrypt the encrypted audio stream is also stored in encrypted form in the MP4 container file. The key required to decrypt the master key is called the "user key."
Each time a customer uses iTunes to buy a track a new random user key is generated and used to encrypt the master key. The random user key is stored, together with the account information, on Apple?s servers, and also sent to iTunes. iTunes stores these keys in its own encrypted key repository. Using this key repository, iTunes is able to retrieve the user key required to decrypt the master key. Using the master key, iTunes is able to decrypt the AAC audio stream and play it.
When a user authorizes a new computer, iTunes sends a unique machine identifier to Apple?s servers. In return it receives all the user keys that are stored with the account information. This ensures that Apple is able to limit the number of computers that are authorized and makes sure that each authorized computer has all the user keys that are needed to play the tracks that it bought.
When a user deauthorizes a computer, iTunes will instruct Apple?s servers to remove the unique machine identifier from their database, and at the same time it will remove all the user keys from its encrypted key repository.
The iPod also has its own encrypted key repository. Every time a FairPlay-protected track is copied onto the iPod, iTunes will copy the user key from its own key repository to the key repository on the iPod. This makes sure that the iPod has everything it needs to play the encrypted AAC audio stream.
FairPlay does not affect the ability of the file itself to be copied. It only manages the decryption of the audio content."
------------------
I hate it when people speak like they know stuff, just for the sake if it, when in fact they haven't a clue. Ticks me off!
As for being tethered, you apparently aren't a good reader (or at least a selective reader). THIS WILL BE PORTABLE to a WIDE variety of MP3 players (not iPod, but this is Apple's decision, NOT Qtrax's) and many cell phones and other portable devices. How is that TETHERED?!
And when I said the iTunes/iPod was a closed system, I meant that you can't use another MP3 player with iTunes, and you can't use the iPod with any other music management systems. That, my friend, is a CLOSED, PROPRIETARY system. And whoever said that AAC was a DRM-free encoding technology was WRONG. AAC is in fact a coding system, but it is OPTIONAL if it is encoded with DRM or not. You see, Apple's own FairPlay DRM is in fact in AAC files. Every iTunes song is an AAC Protected song.
Here's a short summary for your reading pleasure:
"FairPlay is a digital rights management (DRM) technology created by Apple Inc., based on technology created by the company Veridisc. FairPlay is built into the QuickTime multimedia software and used by the iPhone, iPod, iTunes, and iTunes Store and the App Store. Any protected song or other form of media purchased from the iTunes Store with iTunes is encoded with FairPlay. FairPlay digitally encrypts AAC audio files and prevents users from playing these files on unauthorized computers.
How it works
FairPlay-protected files are regular MP4 container files with an encrypted AAC audio stream. The audio stream is encrypted using the AES algorithm in combination with MD5 hashes. The master key required to decrypt the encrypted audio stream is also stored in encrypted form in the MP4 container file. The key required to decrypt the master key is called the "user key."
Each time a customer uses iTunes to buy a track a new random user key is generated and used to encrypt the master key. The random user key is stored, together with the account information, on Apple?s servers, and also sent to iTunes. iTunes stores these keys in its own encrypted key repository. Using this key repository, iTunes is able to retrieve the user key required to decrypt the master key. Using the master key, iTunes is able to decrypt the AAC audio stream and play it.
When a user authorizes a new computer, iTunes sends a unique machine identifier to Apple?s servers. In return it receives all the user keys that are stored with the account information. This ensures that Apple is able to limit the number of computers that are authorized and makes sure that each authorized computer has all the user keys that are needed to play the tracks that it bought.
When a user deauthorizes a computer, iTunes will instruct Apple?s servers to remove the unique machine identifier from their database, and at the same time it will remove all the user keys from its encrypted key repository.
The iPod also has its own encrypted key repository. Every time a FairPlay-protected track is copied onto the iPod, iTunes will copy the user key from its own key repository to the key repository on the iPod. This makes sure that the iPod has everything it needs to play the encrypted AAC audio stream.
FairPlay does not affect the ability of the file itself to be copied. It only manages the decryption of the audio content."
------------------
I hate it when people speak like they know stuff, just for the sake if it, when in fact they haven't a clue. Ticks me off!
#73
ItunesIsDead
- Newbie
-
- Group: Members
- Posts: 10
- Joined: 12-February 09
Posted 12 February 2009 - 08:43 PM
I also want to clarify a few more things in response to posts here (forgot who posted the comments):
1. Paraphrasing: "Why would someone use Qtrax as opposed to continuing to use Limewire of whatever site..." Well, for one thing, Qtrax is FREE of the following: viruses, trojans, keystroke recorders, and other malicious software that you can inadvertently download onto your computer from the illegal sites. Second, you get the EXACT song as originally published by the label. NO varying volume, NO bleed sounds from the person who originally ripped the song and didn't realize his mic was in the mix, NO varying song lengths, NO cut off song, etc. etc.
2. The Qtrax service as it stands today is NOT actually P2P, although that was the original plan (and will still get there). However, currently, ALL songs downloaded from the service will be served from Qtrax's own servers, with the exact songs licensed to them by the labels. This is JUST like the iTunes model.
3. Qtrax has already been SUCCESSFULLY Cloud Load Tested up to 500,000 SIMULTANEOUS users. Yes, a half a million people downloading music from Qtrax ALL AT THE SAME TIME! They used Soasta's cloud testing platform and the system passed the test. ORACLE is their database and infrastructure provider. The biggest, baddest database system in the world. They are not fooling around.
Just stating the facts. Everything I mentioned can be Googled. Check for yourselves.
1. Paraphrasing: "Why would someone use Qtrax as opposed to continuing to use Limewire of whatever site..." Well, for one thing, Qtrax is FREE of the following: viruses, trojans, keystroke recorders, and other malicious software that you can inadvertently download onto your computer from the illegal sites. Second, you get the EXACT song as originally published by the label. NO varying volume, NO bleed sounds from the person who originally ripped the song and didn't realize his mic was in the mix, NO varying song lengths, NO cut off song, etc. etc.
2. The Qtrax service as it stands today is NOT actually P2P, although that was the original plan (and will still get there). However, currently, ALL songs downloaded from the service will be served from Qtrax's own servers, with the exact songs licensed to them by the labels. This is JUST like the iTunes model.
3. Qtrax has already been SUCCESSFULLY Cloud Load Tested up to 500,000 SIMULTANEOUS users. Yes, a half a million people downloading music from Qtrax ALL AT THE SAME TIME! They used Soasta's cloud testing platform and the system passed the test. ORACLE is their database and infrastructure provider. The biggest, baddest database system in the world. They are not fooling around.
Just stating the facts. Everything I mentioned can be Googled. Check for yourselves.
#75
ehren
- Newbie
-
- Group: Members
- Posts: 11
- Joined: 08-October 07
Posted 12 February 2009 - 09:00 PM
Dude, are you serious?
Because we CAN'T. You need to run a PC with Windows Media Player 10. What don't you understand about this?
Yet there are a lot of WMA-capable players that won't be able to play Qtrax music. And if they don't, you aren't able to convert them to MP3, AAC or another more universal format that WILL work with your player.
On the Mac, you can use other music players besides the iPod with iTunes. And for cross-platform convenience, you can use Rockbox or Winamp (with a plugin) to manage your iPod. That's a lot less closed or proprietary than WMA.
Thanks for posting the Wikipedia article. While this is relevant for DRM tracks, this does not matter for the current incarnation of iTunes which allows you to play your files wherever the hell you want, and re-convert them or rip them to your heart's content. Even if you bought protected AAC files, iTunes gives you the opportunity to un-DRM them.
I know. It totally sucks.
ItunesIsDead said:
Chris, do you REALLY mean to tell us that after all your ranting and raving about how bad Qtrax is, that you haven't downloaded the Beta and TRIED THE PRODUCT ????!!!!! Man, you just toasted everything you have written! You haven't a clue what it looks like or how it works!
Because we CAN'T. You need to run a PC with Windows Media Player 10. What don't you understand about this?
Quote
As for being tethered, you apparently aren't a good reader (or at least a selective reader). THIS WILL BE PORTABLE to a WIDE variety of MP3 players (not iPod, but this is Apple's decision, NOT Qtrax's) and many cell phones and other portable devices. How is that TETHERED?!
Yet there are a lot of WMA-capable players that won't be able to play Qtrax music. And if they don't, you aren't able to convert them to MP3, AAC or another more universal format that WILL work with your player.
Quote
And when I said the iTunes/iPod was a closed system, I meant that you can't use another MP3 player with iTunes, and you can't use the iPod with any other music management systems. That, my friend, is a CLOSED, PROPRIETARY system. And whoever said that AAC was a DRM-free encoding technology was WRONG. AAC is in fact a coding system, but it is OPTIONAL if it is encoded with DRM or not. You see, Apple's own FairPlay DRM is in fact in AAC files. Every iTunes song is an AAC Protected song.
On the Mac, you can use other music players besides the iPod with iTunes. And for cross-platform convenience, you can use Rockbox or Winamp (with a plugin) to manage your iPod. That's a lot less closed or proprietary than WMA.
Quote
Here's a short summary for your reading pleasure:
"FairPlay is a digital rights management (DRM) technology created by Apple Inc., based on technology created by the company Veridisc. FairPlay is built into the QuickTime multimedia software and used by the iPhone, iPod, iTunes, and iTunes Store and the App Store. Any protected song or other form of media purchased from the iTunes Store with iTunes is encoded with FairPlay. FairPlay digitally encrypts AAC audio files and prevents users from playing these files on unauthorized computers.
How it works
FairPlay-protected files are regular MP4 container files with an encrypted AAC audio stream. The audio stream is encrypted using the AES algorithm in combination with MD5 hashes. The master key required to decrypt the encrypted audio stream is also stored in encrypted form in the MP4 container file. The key required to decrypt the master key is called the "user key."
Each time a customer uses iTunes to buy a track a new random user key is generated and used to encrypt the master key. The random user key is stored, together with the account information, on Apple?s servers, and also sent to iTunes. iTunes stores these keys in its own encrypted key repository. Using this key repository, iTunes is able to retrieve the user key required to decrypt the master key. Using the master key, iTunes is able to decrypt the AAC audio stream and play it.
When a user authorizes a new computer, iTunes sends a unique machine identifier to Apple?s servers. In return it receives all the user keys that are stored with the account information. This ensures that Apple is able to limit the number of computers that are authorized and makes sure that each authorized computer has all the user keys that are needed to play the tracks that it bought.
When a user deauthorizes a computer, iTunes will instruct Apple?s servers to remove the unique machine identifier from their database, and at the same time it will remove all the user keys from its encrypted key repository.
The iPod also has its own encrypted key repository. Every time a FairPlay-protected track is copied onto the iPod, iTunes will copy the user key from its own key repository to the key repository on the iPod. This makes sure that the iPod has everything it needs to play the encrypted AAC audio stream.
FairPlay does not affect the ability of the file itself to be copied. It only manages the decryption of the audio content."
------------------
"FairPlay is a digital rights management (DRM) technology created by Apple Inc., based on technology created by the company Veridisc. FairPlay is built into the QuickTime multimedia software and used by the iPhone, iPod, iTunes, and iTunes Store and the App Store. Any protected song or other form of media purchased from the iTunes Store with iTunes is encoded with FairPlay. FairPlay digitally encrypts AAC audio files and prevents users from playing these files on unauthorized computers.
How it works
FairPlay-protected files are regular MP4 container files with an encrypted AAC audio stream. The audio stream is encrypted using the AES algorithm in combination with MD5 hashes. The master key required to decrypt the encrypted audio stream is also stored in encrypted form in the MP4 container file. The key required to decrypt the master key is called the "user key."
Each time a customer uses iTunes to buy a track a new random user key is generated and used to encrypt the master key. The random user key is stored, together with the account information, on Apple?s servers, and also sent to iTunes. iTunes stores these keys in its own encrypted key repository. Using this key repository, iTunes is able to retrieve the user key required to decrypt the master key. Using the master key, iTunes is able to decrypt the AAC audio stream and play it.
When a user authorizes a new computer, iTunes sends a unique machine identifier to Apple?s servers. In return it receives all the user keys that are stored with the account information. This ensures that Apple is able to limit the number of computers that are authorized and makes sure that each authorized computer has all the user keys that are needed to play the tracks that it bought.
When a user deauthorizes a computer, iTunes will instruct Apple?s servers to remove the unique machine identifier from their database, and at the same time it will remove all the user keys from its encrypted key repository.
The iPod also has its own encrypted key repository. Every time a FairPlay-protected track is copied onto the iPod, iTunes will copy the user key from its own key repository to the key repository on the iPod. This makes sure that the iPod has everything it needs to play the encrypted AAC audio stream.
FairPlay does not affect the ability of the file itself to be copied. It only manages the decryption of the audio content."
------------------
Thanks for posting the Wikipedia article. While this is relevant for DRM tracks, this does not matter for the current incarnation of iTunes which allows you to play your files wherever the hell you want, and re-convert them or rip them to your heart's content. Even if you bought protected AAC files, iTunes gives you the opportunity to un-DRM them.
Quote
I hate it when people speak like they know stuff, just for the sake if it, when in fact they haven't a clue. Ticks me off!
I know. It totally sucks.
#76
Chris Breen
- Advanced Member
-
- Group: Moderators
- Posts: 3,909
- Joined: 11-December 00
Posted 12 February 2009 - 09:04 PM
ItunesIsDead said:
Chris, do you REALLY mean to tell us that after all your ranting and raving about how bad Qtrax is, that you haven't downloaded the Beta and TRIED THE PRODUCT ????!!!!! Man, you just toasted everything you have written! You haven't a clue what it looks like or how it works!
Oh lord....
Dude, it's a Windows app that requires Windows Media Player 11. This is the Macworld forums. You seeing the connection here? No? Clues are in the bucket over there.
> As for being tethered, you apparently aren't a good reader (or at least a selective reader). THIS WILL BE PORTABLE to a WIDE variety of MP3 players (not iPod, but this is Apple's decision, NOT Qtrax's) and many cell phones and other portable devices. How is that TETHERED?!
MP3, no. Windows Media, yes. Tethered.
> And when I said the iTunes/iPod was a closed system, I meant that you can't use another MP3 player with iTunes, and you can't use the iPod with any other music management systems. That, my friend, is a CLOSED, PROPRIETARY system. And whoever said that AAC was a DRM-free encoding technology was WRONG. AAC is in fact a coding system, but it is OPTIONAL if it is encoded with DRM or not. You see, Apple's own FairPlay DRM is in fact in AAC files. Every iTunes song is an AAC Protected song.
Okay, now you're just being ignorant, intentionally or not. You can look at the definition of AAC here.. After you've finished that bit of research, spend some time reading about iTunes Plus, the DRM-free format that nearly all of iTunes' music is sold in.
Quote
I hate it when people speak like they know stuff, just for the sake if it, when in fact they haven't a clue. Ticks me off!
Oh, the sweet, sweet irony.
#77
Dan Moren
- Advanced Member
-
- Group: Moderators
- Posts: 202
- Joined: 03-March 06
Posted 12 February 2009 - 09:07 PM
The amount of wrongness in this post is simply staggering.
The client isn't Mac-compatible. And, as somebody else pointed out?I think it was Stanley?it's also not currently available as they prepare for the 1.0 launch.
The iPod controls 70% of the US market, and is one of the best selling players in the world. As for it not being Apple's choice, the iPod is compatible with plenty of standard formats, including MP3 and AAC. It's Qtrax that has decided to buy into Windows's DRM-controlled format.
Wrong. Just...wrong. The majority of tracks on iTunes are now DRM-free, presented in unencrypted AAC. AAC is an open standard audio format; it's part of MPEG and was designed to succeed MP3. It's supported by tons of vendors, including Sony, Creative, and, yes, Microsoft. You might want to read up on it. FairPlay DRM is Apple's digital rights management system, which is totally separate from AAC.
Pot, meet kettle.
ItunesIsDead said:
Chris, do you REALLY mean to tell us that after all your ranting and raving about how bad Qtrax is, that you haven't downloaded the Beta and TRIED THE PRODUCT ????!!!!! Man, you just toasted everything you have written! You haven't a clue what it looks like or how it works!
The client isn't Mac-compatible. And, as somebody else pointed out?I think it was Stanley?it's also not currently available as they prepare for the 1.0 launch.
Quote
As for being tethered, you apparently aren't a good reader (or at least a selective reader). THIS WILL BE PORTABLE to a WIDE variety of MP3 players (not iPod, but this is Apple's decision, NOT Qtrax's) and many cell phones and other portable devices. How is that TETHERED?!
The iPod controls 70% of the US market, and is one of the best selling players in the world. As for it not being Apple's choice, the iPod is compatible with plenty of standard formats, including MP3 and AAC. It's Qtrax that has decided to buy into Windows's DRM-controlled format.
Quote
And when I said the iTunes/iPod was a closed system, I meant that you can't use another MP3 player with iTunes, and you can't use the iPod with any other music management systems. That, my friend, is a CLOSED, PROPRIETARY system. And whoever said that AAC was a DRM-free encoding technology was WRONG. AAC is in fact a coding system, but it is OPTIONAL if it is encoded with DRM or not. You see, Apple's own FairPlay DRM is in fact in AAC files. Every iTunes song is an AAC Protected song.
Wrong. Just...wrong. The majority of tracks on iTunes are now DRM-free, presented in unencrypted AAC. AAC is an open standard audio format; it's part of MPEG and was designed to succeed MP3. It's supported by tons of vendors, including Sony, Creative, and, yes, Microsoft. You might want to read up on it. FairPlay DRM is Apple's digital rights management system, which is totally separate from AAC.
Quote
I hate it when people speak like they know stuff, just for the sake if it, when in fact they haven't a clue. Ticks me off!
Pot, meet kettle.
#78
NONfinis
- Member
-
- Group: Members
- Posts: 18
- Joined: 06-June 07
Posted 12 February 2009 - 09:07 PM
1. Yawn.
2. How does it feel to congratulate oneself?
3. You and your split-personalities (look up Dissociative Identity Disorder if you need more info) really do seem to know a good deal about Qtrax... certainly more than one would expect from your average user. In fact, being the self-proclaimed Mac-guy, it's interesting just how much you know about it when Chris couldn't even get the download because it isn't currently working for Macs. How'd you pull that off, "Man"?
4. Teach me how to self-replicate, so that I can bask in the glory of my own praise.
5. The only thing that itunesisdead has ripped a hole in is integrity (oh, and maybe common sense).
6. When playing the odds, which do you think I'd choose? A company that has proven over the last six years that it knows how to tap into the vein of public desire and needs, or the company that has proven it knows how to tap into a pre-existing p-2-p system. Yeah, good luck Qtrax. (If they really wanted to survive, they would find a way to get their media to play nice with iPods.)
7. In the end, it's pointless to argue with you (i.e. itunesisdead, stanley, iphoney, etc. etc. etc.) when nothing you say will convince the large majority of us to switch to a sketchy-sounding service that won't play nice with something we've already come to know and love.
2. How does it feel to congratulate oneself?
3. You and your split-personalities (look up Dissociative Identity Disorder if you need more info) really do seem to know a good deal about Qtrax... certainly more than one would expect from your average user. In fact, being the self-proclaimed Mac-guy, it's interesting just how much you know about it when Chris couldn't even get the download because it isn't currently working for Macs. How'd you pull that off, "Man"?
4. Teach me how to self-replicate, so that I can bask in the glory of my own praise.
5. The only thing that itunesisdead has ripped a hole in is integrity (oh, and maybe common sense).
6. When playing the odds, which do you think I'd choose? A company that has proven over the last six years that it knows how to tap into the vein of public desire and needs, or the company that has proven it knows how to tap into a pre-existing p-2-p system. Yeah, good luck Qtrax. (If they really wanted to survive, they would find a way to get their media to play nice with iPods.)
7. In the end, it's pointless to argue with you (i.e. itunesisdead, stanley, iphoney, etc. etc. etc.) when nothing you say will convince the large majority of us to switch to a sketchy-sounding service that won't play nice with something we've already come to know and love.
#79
Chris Breen
- Advanced Member
-
- Group: Moderators
- Posts: 3,909
- Joined: 11-December 00
Posted 12 February 2009 - 09:17 PM
Stanley said:
I can understand if you are a hardcore ipod user, Qtrax won't be for you for now.
I get my music from a lot of places. It's unlikely Qtrax will ever be for me. If I need a massive library, I use Rhapsody, which can play through my TiVo box and Sonos Multi-Room Music System as well as my computers. I'm the unusual Mac user that appreciates subscription music services like Rhapsody. I'm more than happy to pay for that kind of flexibility. Many people aren't.
>But how about everyone else that doesn't use I-pods. Sounds like a cash cow right there to me.
I'd agree if there were massive numbers of Windows Media music players as popular as the iPod. But there just aren't and Qtrax isn't going to make that so.
>You are going to see, a lot of people will be interested in a free library larger than I-tunes
I've followed this stuff since the beginning of iTunes and the iPod. I've heard these kinds of inflated claims over and over and over again and each time the alleged iTunes- or iPod killer is in the scrap heap within two years. Maybe Qtrax will prove to be the exception, but with its DRM and tethered-to-Windows-Media-Player-model, I doubt it.
#81
ItunesIsDead
- Newbie
-
- Group: Members
- Posts: 10
- Joined: 12-February 09
Posted 12 February 2009 - 10:18 PM
I guess this whole thing boils down to the Windows vs PC debate. Oh the war that will never end.
My solution is that I live in BOTH worlds, unlike some who may have their head stuck in the sand. I am a Mac user, and I also use PCs. I love my Mac, but I NEED my PC because I live in the business world. I have both a Mac and a PC on my desk. Frankly, I don't care which platform I use to get my music. With my iPod, I have to erase the damn thing and start over when switching between the two computers.THAT'S TETHERED! I hate that! Maybe you should give me your definition of tethered because MY definition of being UN-tethered is that I can take my music with me. I'm not tied to my computer (as in a streaming delivery system). I could give a crap if the music I am listening to is DRM'd or not. All I care is that I can hear it, and that it's FREE. The free part allows me the freedom to explore and try out new artists without going broke, or worse, not downloading an artist I may end up liking, for financial reasons.
All I care is that I DON'T HAVE TO PAY for the music and that I AM LEGAL in obtaining those tracks. That's the bottom line.
And GET OFF YOUR HORSE ABOUT APPLE BEING DRM-FREE. THEY JUST ANNOUNCED that their whole library is going to be DRM-free. You act like it's been this way since day one. Heck, they're not even finished converting all the tracks yet. And yes, I know that you've been able to buy some tracks DRM-free, but not the ENTIRE library, which they just announced at the last conference.
I don't see where I was wrong about my definition of the AAC format. Tell me where I'm off.
And by the way, Qtrax is based on the Songbird player. Songbird runs on the Mac. Songbird is also Quicktime compatible (meaning able to play AAC files) as well as WMA compatible. I know that they have a solution to this issue, but I don't know the details.
Eventually, we will see DRM-Free music on Qtrax. You guys are judging the baby. It still has to grow and mature. And it will. Quickly. We'll let the public decide whether it will be all the rage or not. Mac users are THE MINORITY, but nonetheless are growing in numbers. I am both a Mac and a PC user, and I know that there are pros and cons to each platform.
But WORLDWIDE, there are mostly PC users. That's the current target. The Mac platform will follow.
Look, we don't all drive Honda's. There will be many venues for people to choose from. They will have to coexist and what's right for one person may not be right for the next.
This whole argument started from the article that was lopsided in its coverage. This discussion was necessary to bring a more balanced perspective on Qtrax and the music industry in general. The industry is changing. And if Apple doesn't change with it, they will loose market share. If they are smart, THEY will be the ones to play nicely with the rest of the world. They will not be able to keep a death grip on the music industry.
My solution is that I live in BOTH worlds, unlike some who may have their head stuck in the sand. I am a Mac user, and I also use PCs. I love my Mac, but I NEED my PC because I live in the business world. I have both a Mac and a PC on my desk. Frankly, I don't care which platform I use to get my music. With my iPod, I have to erase the damn thing and start over when switching between the two computers.THAT'S TETHERED! I hate that! Maybe you should give me your definition of tethered because MY definition of being UN-tethered is that I can take my music with me. I'm not tied to my computer (as in a streaming delivery system). I could give a crap if the music I am listening to is DRM'd or not. All I care is that I can hear it, and that it's FREE. The free part allows me the freedom to explore and try out new artists without going broke, or worse, not downloading an artist I may end up liking, for financial reasons.
All I care is that I DON'T HAVE TO PAY for the music and that I AM LEGAL in obtaining those tracks. That's the bottom line.
And GET OFF YOUR HORSE ABOUT APPLE BEING DRM-FREE. THEY JUST ANNOUNCED that their whole library is going to be DRM-free. You act like it's been this way since day one. Heck, they're not even finished converting all the tracks yet. And yes, I know that you've been able to buy some tracks DRM-free, but not the ENTIRE library, which they just announced at the last conference.
I don't see where I was wrong about my definition of the AAC format. Tell me where I'm off.
And by the way, Qtrax is based on the Songbird player. Songbird runs on the Mac. Songbird is also Quicktime compatible (meaning able to play AAC files) as well as WMA compatible. I know that they have a solution to this issue, but I don't know the details.
Eventually, we will see DRM-Free music on Qtrax. You guys are judging the baby. It still has to grow and mature. And it will. Quickly. We'll let the public decide whether it will be all the rage or not. Mac users are THE MINORITY, but nonetheless are growing in numbers. I am both a Mac and a PC user, and I know that there are pros and cons to each platform.
But WORLDWIDE, there are mostly PC users. That's the current target. The Mac platform will follow.
Look, we don't all drive Honda's. There will be many venues for people to choose from. They will have to coexist and what's right for one person may not be right for the next.
This whole argument started from the article that was lopsided in its coverage. This discussion was necessary to bring a more balanced perspective on Qtrax and the music industry in general. The industry is changing. And if Apple doesn't change with it, they will loose market share. If they are smart, THEY will be the ones to play nicely with the rest of the world. They will not be able to keep a death grip on the music industry.
#82
ItunesIsDead
- Newbie
-
- Group: Members
- Posts: 10
- Joined: 12-February 09
Posted 12 February 2009 - 10:19 PM
What?
#83
Arananthi
- Newbie
-
- Group: Members
- Posts: 1
- Joined: 12-February 09
Posted 12 February 2009 - 10:23 PM
JDW said "Unless you can boast to be over 100 years old, it would not seem possible that you have the personal experience that makes you an expert who can blatantly state, "all monopolies eventually die" (which also implies many die without government intervention). "
Just like to point out, this is horrible reasoning. Inductive logic introduces any debater to the idea that if you have no contrary evidence, and a passable sample size, you can make a point based on limited personal experience. Furthermore, the post you're attacking made no claims that monopolies die without government interference, as you imply.
And, strictly speaking, all monopolies do, in fact, eventually die. Ask the dinosaurs; I understand they once had a monopoly on being giant lizards.
Michael Danielson
From The Inside
Just like to point out, this is horrible reasoning. Inductive logic introduces any debater to the idea that if you have no contrary evidence, and a passable sample size, you can make a point based on limited personal experience. Furthermore, the post you're attacking made no claims that monopolies die without government interference, as you imply.
And, strictly speaking, all monopolies do, in fact, eventually die. Ask the dinosaurs; I understand they once had a monopoly on being giant lizards.
Michael Danielson
From The Inside
#84
Dan Frakes
- Advanced Member
-
- Group: Moderators
- Posts: 3,763
- Joined: 14-April 03
Posted 12 February 2009 - 10:56 PM
Sorry, but The Truth called and demanded someone respond to these comments ;)
Apple has had the four major labels and many indies for years.
You keep on using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.
Apple would have had to see Qtrax coming two years ago, in May 2007, when the iTunes Store first started offering DRM-free tracks. Or, more accurately, quite a while before that, when Apple first approached all the majors about DRM-free tracks. Apple definitely saw something coming, but it wasn't Qtrax.
A closed system would be one where the only kind of music you could play on an iPod was stuff you purchased from the iTunes Store.
This will be portable to devices whose vendors license the ability to play one specific kind of DRM WMA files. Such players currently make up, to borrow a phrase, "a TINY share of the worldwide player market."
(not iPod, but this is Apple's decision, NOT Qtrax's)
Qtrax chose to go with DRM WMA, knowing full well that the best-selling player in the world wouldn't be able to play those tracks. Apple had no say in the matter.
whoever said that AAC was a DRM-free encoding technology was WRONG. AAC is in fact a coding system, but it is OPTIONAL if it is encoded with DRM or not. You see, Apple's own FairPlay DRM is in fact in AAC files. Every iTunes song is an AAC Protected song.
1) AAC is a codec. An open, industry-standard codec. FairPlay is a DRM technology. The two are independent of one another. FairPlay can be applied to an AAC file, but it is not required and, in fact, AAC existed before FairPlay.
2) Since May 2007, the iTunes Store has been selling some tracks without DRM. Currently a substantial chunk of all iTunes Store music is DRM-free.
Now that we've covered some facts, let's discuss opinions:
Qtrax will be a HUGE success and will really change the music world as we know it.
Apple has ~75% of the U.S. "MP3 player" market and ~50% globally. I don't think a music service that doesn't work with the iPod is going to be a huge success. I don't think people are going to throw their iPods in the trash and go buy one that will play DRM'd WMA files just so they can use this service. I think that as long as Qtrax works only on DRM-WMA players, the people willing to pay artists will continue to use iTunes, eMusic, and other services that work with the iPod and other non-DRM-WMA players; the people who refuse to pay will pirate, just as they're doing now.
A time will come, I believe, when some (and eventually all) music will be distributed "free" -- supported by advertising or some other source of revenue. But Qtrax's current model is not going to be the deliverer of such a future, in my opinion.
ItunesIsDead said:
Qtrax has all FOUR labels and their publishers and most major indies - something Apple hasn't achieved.
Apple has had the four major labels and many indies for years.
Quote
the iPod has a TINY share if the worldwide player market.
You keep on using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.
Quote
DRM was Apple's, until they saw Qtrax coming (that's why they are going DRM-free.
Apple would have had to see Qtrax coming two years ago, in May 2007, when the iTunes Store first started offering DRM-free tracks. Or, more accurately, quite a while before that, when Apple first approached all the majors about DRM-free tracks. Apple definitely saw something coming, but it wasn't Qtrax.
Quote
the iPod is a closed system. iPod/iTunes and that's it.
A closed system would be one where the only kind of music you could play on an iPod was stuff you purchased from the iTunes Store.
Quote
THIS WILL BE PORTABLE to a WIDE variety of MP3 players...and many cell phones and other portable devices.
This will be portable to devices whose vendors license the ability to play one specific kind of DRM WMA files. Such players currently make up, to borrow a phrase, "a TINY share of the worldwide player market."
(not iPod, but this is Apple's decision, NOT Qtrax's)
Qtrax chose to go with DRM WMA, knowing full well that the best-selling player in the world wouldn't be able to play those tracks. Apple had no say in the matter.
whoever said that AAC was a DRM-free encoding technology was WRONG. AAC is in fact a coding system, but it is OPTIONAL if it is encoded with DRM or not. You see, Apple's own FairPlay DRM is in fact in AAC files. Every iTunes song is an AAC Protected song.
1) AAC is a codec. An open, industry-standard codec. FairPlay is a DRM technology. The two are independent of one another. FairPlay can be applied to an AAC file, but it is not required and, in fact, AAC existed before FairPlay.
2) Since May 2007, the iTunes Store has been selling some tracks without DRM. Currently a substantial chunk of all iTunes Store music is DRM-free.
Now that we've covered some facts, let's discuss opinions:
Qtrax will be a HUGE success and will really change the music world as we know it.
Apple has ~75% of the U.S. "MP3 player" market and ~50% globally. I don't think a music service that doesn't work with the iPod is going to be a huge success. I don't think people are going to throw their iPods in the trash and go buy one that will play DRM'd WMA files just so they can use this service. I think that as long as Qtrax works only on DRM-WMA players, the people willing to pay artists will continue to use iTunes, eMusic, and other services that work with the iPod and other non-DRM-WMA players; the people who refuse to pay will pirate, just as they're doing now.
A time will come, I believe, when some (and eventually all) music will be distributed "free" -- supported by advertising or some other source of revenue. But Qtrax's current model is not going to be the deliverer of such a future, in my opinion.
