[Macworld]

Post your comments for The Microsoft discount here

[meghan_yan]

Hey Macworld editors!
You might want to ask David Pogue to reprint his June 1998 Macworld column "David does windows" here. - Although it refers to Win95 / Win98, it´s as valid as ever. - Here´s my favourite excerpt:
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After two weeks, it finally hit me: I’m not a Mac bigot. In fact, I have no particular attachment to the Mac at all; if something superior comes along, I’m there.
No, what I am is an elegance bigot. If I’m going to sit in front of this thing for hours a day, I want to feel the intelligence that went into my operating system. I want to sense that an English major lost sleep over the wording of the menus. I shouldn’t have to teach my computer what kinds of files it has by adding .TXT and .PSD to their names. I don’t want a system font that looks like somebody drew it on the bus to work. And I want my OS components to be icons that I can move or throw away--not lines of code that I must edit when troubleshooting.
Elegance, I’m afraid, wasn’t a high priority in Windows 95. The programmers may be top-notch, but I’ll bet the number who’ve studied art history, Haydn string quartets, or Bang & Olufson stereos could fit in my Honda Civic.
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Regards
Matt

[iTravel]

Thanks very much for writing that article.
I haven't seen these Microsoft ads in question, but I agree with you completely.
After all, my wife needed to use windows for a course she signed up for. We looked and saw that, yes, computers that ran windows WERE cheaper, but it would involve using windows all the time during, and after the course.
So, in the end, we bought a macbook and installed windows with bootcamp.
After all, if we did buy a pc for windows, it would just.. involve using.... windows... all the time.
Software is definitely more important to me than hardware. I'll easily sacrifice a few 'spec's to run a system as good as OSX.

[kresh]

Ha! Now Microsoft has 'Jobs' envy. They look at Balmer and wonder why he is not pulling one amazing rabbit product after another out of the hat.
I mean with Balmer all you get his him pulling one long brown thing after another out of the toilet!

[kresh]

uhm... I meant a brown Zune out of the toilet guys...

[meghan_yan]

I haven't seen him pulling anything ever...
The zune was in the toilet from the beginning, and I haven't seen it coming up ever since ...

[lkrndu]

Boy. I have to sign on with the 'agree' side, and in particular @ megan_yan and the Pogue remarks - the '98 piece was hardly the only time Pogue said essentially the same thing.
I'm an over-60 photographer and instructor of photography. I'm absolutely certain that if you poll my students you will confirm that I am NOT 'cool'. I carry a MacBook Pro around...AND I 'administer' (love that corny term) a 'system' of two PCs under Windows XP with Photoshop and so on.
I don't know how much your Italian IT tech gets as a chargeout rate for troubleshooting and tweeking (sic) a sadly klutzy OS but if I made $2.50 an hour for the time I've lost cajoling things under Windows to behave as advertised (that is, to work at all in many cases) I'd have retired long since.
As I say, I carry around the MBP. And use it. End of story. Wish cheap Windows came even close to that. Anybody tried to get rid of the silly games that install along with the updates, lately?
Hmmmm?

[mkmcfr]

I don't even know if this merits commenting on, but I think in your effort to be even-handed, you've missed the point once again. Yes, you're right, it's not just the machine, but you could make a point for Macs being better assembled. And, of course, you're right about the OS. And, its not just a matter of taste because, aside from esthetics, OSX works better. But, the point is, PCs are not less expensive, because once you've bought the machine, you've got to buy the apps you use in it. I thought Macs were more expensive, too, until I bought one and found out that they come with everything you need to get started, except maybe iWork, but it's only 79 bucks. Compare that to Office, in whatever version you get and you've already made up the difference. You can go for Aperture, but you can really get by with iPhoto. Actually, I think Windows started adding a few apps to their OS in response to what Apple was offering. It seems normal to me, that the hardware would be a little less expensive if it comes without the software.

[Mista2]

I have a Mac Mini, and I would have to say that using boot camp made that the easiest windows install that I have ever done. However I am posting this from my HP tablet primarily because Apple don't make one and I find it very handy having the pen and handwriting recognition as I am not the worlds fastest typist 8). Note! My HP costs more than a Macbook pro and has a slower CPU, is made of plastic but is a full screen-flipping around tablet that can run everything I need, but I really don't like anything about Windows, I just wish it could legally run OS X.

[mslavick]

You're wrong about a couple of things. Mac users wear Members Only jackets and we don't "roam around," we ride Segways.

[DonSmith]

I haven't seen the obvious yet; the comparisons don't mention that you get the cheapest version of Windows whereas you get ALL the power of Mac OS X on EVERY Mac computer! Then, there's the "back-door" tax of buying MS crap; Virus Protection! You HAVE to buy it! All those Conficker rerports? All on PC's! I've been a Mac guy since 1989 and I've not run virus protection yet! If you buy PC, then add in the cost of upgrading to MS's most powerful version of Windows to fairly compare to the all-power version of Mac OS X, and then add in the back-door tax of virus protection for your new PC. Then, consider that your new machine will likely be running Vista, the MS OS that has been an absolute disaster, and then tell me that buying Windows is a smart, money saving move. Oh yes, almost forgot; I hope you don't have a hard drive crash to experience the GRIEF of re-authorizing your Windows OS. No "authorizing" on Mac OS X. No nickel-and-dime'ing you to no end to get your computer running again.

[Flope]

My son needed a Windows laptop while he was working toward his degree in computer engineering. We got him a Dell, more or less top of the middle, machine. The most valuable accessory I bought was the three year extended warranty. Two years later, after dozens of repairs including several logic boards, several LCD screens, two or three hard disks (and graduation) he asked for an received a MacBook Pro. He has had the MacBook Pro for a year an a half without any problems, and, of course, he can run Windows when he must.
In my law office we use all Macs, except we must keep one WinTel machine for self defense. Every once in a while a court reporter will send us a floppy disk containing a file that can only be opened in Windows, or a court will send us something in WordPerfect (who uses THAT?). There are also some law practice specific applications that, although I can run them in Parallels on my MacBook Pro, just run a little faster an easier on the dedicated WinTel machine. For that I have built my own WinTel machine. Theoretically, that was cheaper than buying from a WinTel manufacturer, but, counting the time spent doing it, I am not sure. The thing is, I have not had to send any WinTel machine I built back to the manufacturer. Oddly, the machines that I put together myself have run without problem.
Maybe if the WinTel folks weren't trying so hard to make their machines so cheap, they might make them better. That would eliminate the Microsoft discount and the Apple tax. But then the two operating systems would have to compete directly, so, I guess that wont be happening.

[Philbert]

To the people claiming Mac users buy Macs simply because of "cool":
You can't buy cool. A label doesn't make something (or those that use it), cool. One look at Kay's website tells me that guy couldn't be cool if he was surrounded by a 1000 Macs.
Cool ... just is. And like Kay, Microsoft will never be cool because that's just not in their DNA.
Make no mistake, Microsoft is DESPERATELY trying to be cool. The recent ads -- "I'm a PC and I'm a stereotype", and the Lauren ad (even tho' she says "I'm just not cool enough to be a Mac person", she is very much cool.), are desperate attempts to try to overturn their deservedly "uncool" persona.
And that's their mistake - they try to be something they're not. Apple has been successful because they focus on their strengths - innovation and quality design (and design is NOT just about hardware, it's also about the entire user experience - from the packaging to the ability to use an iPhone as a remote control)
I don't buy Apple products because they're cool. Cool is just a bonus.
-phil

[ksrhee24]

After using MS for more than 20 years, I switched over to Mac about 2 years ago, and I couldn't be happier. My first computer was Apple II, but I had to switch to PC when I went back to school to get my MBA.
If you want to talk price/discount/tax, I would like to add Value of Time as well as ROI for Time spent.
I used to spend hours and hours each week trying to troubleshoot windows (Windows 95, 98, Me, 2000, XP, and Vista) over the years, and although it has gotten better with XP (Vista is another story altogether), it still made me invest time to get things done. Now with my Mac, I don't spend all those hours fixing what's wrong, I spend those hours being productive. So, when it comes to time value or ROI, Mac provides a greater return. Also, I don't spend each morning twiddling my thumbs for Windows to boot up in my laptop any more. I never put my Windows laptop to sleep since I encountered the fire hazard twice in my lifetime (they woke up and didn't go back to sleep; so, they were super hot in my briefcase).
Furthermore, any objective IT person (one who is not biased against Mac) will also tell you that Mac's are saving companies tons of money as well.
Also, another thing these kind folks who trash Mac's don't tell you is that it takes more processors and memory to run Windows (Vista) than Mac OS X. My wife has a MacBook (2.2Ghz) with 2G of RAM, and her MacBook runs circles around my last windows laptop I purchased around the same time (Thinkpad 2.4G, 2G RAM).
So, I would say it's not Mac Users who are paying "tax" when it comes to purchasing Mac's, but it's actually Windows users that do in terms of productivity and "lost hairs" -- I recall many instances where I wanted to pull my hairs out when using Windows.
Most of all, I am so much happier now, and that, as the Master Card commercial states, is "priceless" anyway.