[Nobody]

Try directing your "notation" to the ones WHO started the "personal insults" huh? /forums/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad.gif

[sirmacsalot3]

Oh now I get it... The Mini is a 2nd computer. Whether you own a Mac or a PC the Mini will be the computer that you use to...run iTunes by sitting the Mini next to your stereo system... Display all those lovely iPhoto HD slide shows on your new DVI equipped HD Television...or play a game ... Bring with you to the cottage where you've left that old 17" CRT and keyboard... My only gripe is the 40Gb HD. If Apple sells a lot of 40Gb and 60Gb iPods I would think that they should have offered an 80Gb hard drive in both Mini models and larger HDs as an BTO option. Good Job Steve. You've made a good cheap portable Mac. Now don't blow it by marketing it incorrectly. This is The Appliance the Mac has always wanted to be.

[chaos]

In reply to:

---

I'm curious whether by the time one buys the mini, adds a 17" monitor, keyboard, and mouse, the price wouldn't be essentially what the eMac now goes for (on the low end).

---

True enough (if you had to buy all the components), but for nearly the same price you can have less weight, less of a footprint, less eye strain, less noise, less energy consumption, and way more style.
eMac
---------------------------
1.25 GHz PowerPC
256MB RAM
40GB hard drive
ATI Radeon 9200; 32MB RAM
Combo drive
10/100BASE-T Ethernet
56K V.92 modem
3 USB 2.0 ports
2 FireWire 400 ports
17" (16" viewable) CRT display
w/Integrated stereo speakers
Apple Keyboard
Apple Mouse
$799.00
iMac mini
---------------------------
1.25 GHz PowerPC
256MB RAM
40GB hard drive
ATI Radeon 9200; 32MB RAM
Combo drive
10/100BASE-T Ethernet
56K V.92 modem
2 USB 2.0 ports
1 FireWire 400 port
17" Silver DVI LCD display
w/Integrated stereo speakers
Apple Keyboard
Apple Mouse

$822.99

CTX S762G (Silver) 17" LCD Monitor w/ Speakers, DVI from NewEgg (http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProductDesc.asp?description=24-103-191&depa=1)

A little extra for the matching LCD and going digital rather than analog. I also wanted the brightness, response time, etc to be good.
Going with something like the Rosewill R700J Silver 17" Active Matrix LCD Monitor with Speakers from NewEgg (http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProductDesc.asp?description=24-021-014&depa=1) would drop the overall Mac mini price to $785 ($14 less than the eMac), but I would spend a little more for DVI rather than VGA.
Course the extra USB and FireWire on the eMac is hard to add to the Mac mini... /forums/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/tongue.gif

[JakeT]

A lot of people have a monitor at the office and one at home. This computer would be real easy to take home. And since most people have monitors, you could take it with you to a friend, relative, etc.

[chaos]

"Apparently, Wall Street doesn't agree with any one here, accept me of course. I'm betting that the Mini will be the flop the Cube was (although the Cube was twice as good for it's day) and the math won't lie, neither will the mounting inventory by years end - can't wait to say "told you so".
At close today - AAPL 64.56 -4.40% (biggest drop on the NASDAC All Today!)
I AM, Mr. KnowItAll"

Actually Apple isn't even in the top 10 declines on the NASDAQ today:
TASR 14.10 -29.68%
DNDN 7.62 -26.66%
ANTP 30.39 -23.12%
LCRD 8.799 -18.68%
SYPR 12.93 -16.96%
OLAB 2.75 -16.16%
MRGO 6.41 -15.76%
TAYD 4.48 -15.15%
OLED 8.83 -14.69%
KNOL 2.85 -14.16%

[moose_n_squirrel]

I think a lotta people are missing the evidence here. The clue to Apple's intentions is right there on the first line of the Mini web page:
"The modular design of Mac mini lets you upgrade your current system to the elegance, simplicity and reliability of Macintosh."
How does Apple suppose you "upgrade" a current system to a cheaper, smaller Mac? If you already have a keyboard, mouse, and monitor, and you just replace the CPU. This thing is clearly aimed at people who have a PC they're unhappy with so that they are willing to dump it but keep the peripherals. The same masses who never, ever (listen, geeks) EVER upgrade the insides.The marketing and pricing are not at all targeting people who are pricing a complete new kickasz system. It is meant to be $499.
Underpowered compared to a G5? Yes. But not underpowered compared to the PowerBook, and people seem to think a PowerBook can be your only computer.

[lhudd]

No. not a pie in the sky idea at all. If you think the addition of a bluetooth module in EVERY mini raises Apple's costs per unit more than a few cents, you're kidding youself. Think about what they already invest in the system... they have to pre-build an antenna in each unit... install a socket and other wiring on the mainboard... various other support items (programming drivers, etc). Now every unit gets these treatments, and maybe only 20% of purchasers buy the bluetooth module. All this trouble for a mere $50 per unit. Apple actually technically loses money on the units not including Bluetooth. This is why you never see manual windows available for automobiles anymore. Manufacturers realized it cost them more money to offer it as an option than what they were earning in profits in making it an option. Plus, it feels good to get a car with power windows.
Analagize that to the computer market. Apple is targeting Windows users with this box. Why not just give them Bluetooth as a "gee whiz" item. No PC maker is giving away bluetooth in their $499 boxes... apple can very cheaply use it as way to entice others to the platform. Inrtroduce newbies to the wonders of bluetooth. Apple puts firewire in every computer... why not bluetooth. Are you complaining on behalf of those that don't use firewire for the extra cost passed on to them? I'd be willing to bet that Apple could sell the boxes for $399 and still turn a nice profit.. the price point is a strategy more than anything.
You're also neglecting another benefit to including the bluetooth module with every iMac Mini... secondary sales of bluetooth keyboards. If i'm looking to buy a Mini, I'd like to get a spiffy Apple keyboard, but I'm much more likely to pull the trigger on it if I only have to buy the keyboard and not the extra $50 BT module to go with it. The mouse might also get added sales, but as far as i'm concerned, Apple mice are worthless... I want at least two buttons and a scroll wheel.

[lhudd]

That's flawed strategy... you win over windows users by offering MORE stuff for the same price. I actually convinced a good friend and longtime Windows user to make his next laptop purchase a Powerbook SOLELY because Bluetooth was only available on the higher priced Dell units. He wanted Firewire and bluetooth and the 12" powerbook gave him that for $1500. After I convinced him that Office worked the same way on the Mac as it did on Windows... he was sold....
That's how you switch skeptical windows users.

[Mac_Envy]

Hi, I'm a lifelong PC user who has always envied the first party mac software. After seeing the Mac Mini online I've become very interested in owning a second computer. I consider myself to be very familiar with computers, I run a pretty powerful Amd 2400+ I built myself for gaming and everything else. I wouldn't get rid of my pc after buying a Mac Mini, but would purchase a KVM switch to cooperatively use both computers with my keyboard, mouse and monitor currently connected to my pc. I was wondering if I could easily transfer files between the Mac Mini and my pc easily and often, or would I have to use a program like move2mac every time? I ask this becuase I have a built in card reader on my pc and would like to transfer pictures taken on my digital camera between the computers to my mac mini from my pc, becuase loading the images to a computer using a card reader is much easier than the supplied computer connection cable. Because I take many pictures, i would have to transfer pictures to my mac mini very often. If this isn't possible or is cumbersome, then perhaps a mac mini isn't the choice for me, also, becuase my pc had 260gb of hard drive space, I would be able to purchase the 40gb mac mini and just transfer files to my pc for storage when i needed to. Alos i could edit videos on my mac mini and transfer them to my pc which already has a cd/dvd rw so i would'nt have to buy one for the mini.
Another question is, in your opinion is it worth it to buy the more expensive 1.42ghz mac mini then the 1.25 mini for the processor speed alone? That much of a difference isn't much for pc processors, but I really dont know anything about mac processors, it seems like the 1.42 is just an overclocked 1.25, and in the same case, which means the 1.25 could easily be overclocked to 1.42 without overheating, which makes it seem like a crappy deal for charging more for it.
One final question, is bluetooth worth it, and what is the feasibility of bringing your mac mini while traveling with an airport express card and a small monitor and plugging them in at places like airports? it seems like those fold out keyboards and small mice would be necessary too now, that actually sounds pretty cumbersome, what do you think? Thanks for any input, I hope my questions make sense, I really haven't used a mac since the old school apple 2.

[lhudd]

yeah except that all windows computers come with keyboards and mice that use non-USB connectors. Every PC i've ever bought came with ps/2 mice and keyboards. Only aftermarket replacement keyboards come with USB ports.

[CheGuevarra]

Hmmmm, now I'm thinking. Isn't the mini going to kill their upgrade sales margin? Why would any non-professional who already owns a monitor and keyboard ever buy another new desktop model? I wonder if they'll come out with new versions of the mini in the future that only work with newer monitors with different interface standards... This seems odd, but I'm sure SJ has a strategy. The fact is though that they will lose sales on all other (more expensive) models. Looks like they're going for consumer volume over their traditional showcase-niche product strategy.
Are they totally going for the mass market now? I think this means Apple finally feels it can start to win the consumer computer market. If not, why do it? Maybe it's time for MS to walk the sad, but profitable, road that IBM walked 15 years ago.
It just seems so odd to me that I can now upgrade my G4 with a mini and keep my monitor for $500 instead of the $1200 price I usually pay every 2-4 years.

[Mac_Envy]

In response to Rubaiyat, who spoke about pc users being dissapointed in mac speeds. Similar to that, I have speculated that the 1.25(or 1.42) ghz rating on the mac minis could be deceptive. The mini-itx motherboards, which are a similar form factor to the mac mini motherboards, as far as i can see, are rated around 1.25ghz processors, yet can barely run a program like quake 1, and with my slimline dvd player with it, the mini-itx motherboards arent even fast enough to VIEW dvds, let alone edit, copy, and burn them with a program like iLife. Of course my slimline drive speed probably affected this, but most laptops with the same drives can view dvds fine. I doubt apple would be dumb enough to release a product that couldn't even run its own software, but I'm wary that it will just barely run it. I'm especially concerned, becuase for me, purchasing the mac Mini would be mostly for using its creative suites. Even worse, what if Jobs bundled a slimmed down iLife MINI? Just a few thoughts.

[chaos]

In reply to:

---

No. not a pie in the sky idea at all. If you think the addition of a bluetooth module in EVERY mini raises Apple's costs per unit more than a few cents, you're kidding youself. Think about what they already invest in the system... they have to pre-build an antenna in each unit... install a socket and other wiring on the mainboard... various other support items (programming drivers, etc). Now every unit gets these treatments, and maybe only 20% of purchasers buy the bluetooth module. All this trouble for a mere $50 per unit. Apple actually technically loses money on the units not including Bluetooth. This is why you never see manual windows available for automobiles anymore. Manufacturers realized it cost them more money to offer it as an option than what they were earning in profits in making it an option. Plus, it feels good to get a car with power windows.
Analagize that to the computer market. Apple is targeting Windows users with this box. Why not just give them Bluetooth as a "gee whiz" item. No PC maker is giving away bluetooth in their $499 boxes... apple can very cheaply use it as way to entice others to the platform. Inrtroduce newbies to the wonders of bluetooth. Apple puts firewire in every computer... why not bluetooth. Are you complaining on behalf of those that don't use firewire for the extra cost passed on to them? I'd be willing to bet that Apple could sell the boxes for $399 and still turn a nice profit.. the price point is a strategy more than anything.
You're also neglecting another benefit to including the bluetooth module with every iMac Mini... secondary sales of bluetooth keyboards. If i'm looking to buy a Mini, I'd like to get a spiffy Apple keyboard, but I'm much more likely to pull the trigger on it if I only have to buy the keyboard and not the extra $50 BT module to go with it. The mouse might also get added sales, but as far as i'm concerned, Apple mice are worthless... I want at least two buttons and a scroll wheel.

---

Apple includes an antenna for 802.11g - so should they include that as well? By the same token are they not loosing money on every unit sold that doesn't include it?
I'll agree with you that Bluetooth should be built-in, but only because I'd (selfishly) like to see Bluetooth embraced by other companies that could provide the Mac community with other options for mice and keyboards (ie Logitech, Microsoft, etc). Specifically the mice and keyboard combos - more specifically being able to map the extra mice buttons and remap the keyboard keys.

[Shrek220]

Has somebody done a survey that confirms there's a huge number of disaffected Windows users that are so keen to abandon their investment in Wintel that they'll put their hard-earned dollars on a computing platform that they know nothing about? Except maybe that Apple makes a nifty line in MP3 players?
Most Wintel people I know don't know Apple even make a valid alternative platform.
For $499US you can have a poorly spec'd computer that has no monitor, has no keyboard, has no mouse, won't run their expensive software natively. What a deal.
I guess this Mac mini will succeed if the Windows users are as thick as the people on this board make them out to be. Personally, I will be very surprised if this device succeeds. Then again, I was wrong about the iPod mini. Seems there are a lot of idiots out there.