[MW Forums]

The Silicon Valley Toxics Coalition (SVTC)—the same environmental group that drew the attention of Apple CEO Steve Jobs at the company’s shareholder meeting yesterday—on Friday shot back at statements Jobs made about the company’s environmental policies. While the groups initial charges were broad, they narrowed the focus on many of the issues in their responses today. more

[jmincey]

Excellent article by Jim. I appreciate especially that he not only reports the response of the environmental group but that his eye was on the omissions too and that he made a point to call attention to the LACK of response to certain points as well. Good balance and good information. Thanks for following up on this.

[bspears]

In reply to:

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Jobs countered claims that Apple did not have an effective computer takeback program by pointing out that Apple has had such a program for four years, recycling over 1,500 tons in the last year. The SVTC said in response that while that may sound like a lot, it doesn't compare to the 5,000 tons that HP collected in a six-week program.

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If I owned an HP PeeCee I would probably want it recyled too. My old Macs on the other hand are still in use performing various functions around the house. The SVTC is apparently unaware that people do NOT throw their old Macs away because they do not become useless hunks of envirotoxin as rapidly as PCs do.
bob /forums/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif

[spimster]

Lots and lots of publicity for both groups.
Whatever.
HP has MORE tonnage than Apple?!?!
Imagine that!
I don't throw away my Macs.
They are all still in use in one way or another, even the old 6220.
And, so is my brother's Mac Plus; he uses it still for programming for one old machine (and perhaps a little bit of nostalgia -- but it still works).
I know for certain that I'm not going to just "toss" my $500 iPod when it stops working right.
Recycling is a good thing, but it does seem like they are riding Apple's coattails into the spotlight a bit.
Just my 2 . . YMMV.

[fribhey]

i for one would much rather just throw my ipod away then replace the battery.... yeah right. are these people smoking crack?
what's worse for the environment? - using tons of regular, non rechargeable batteries OR using ONE rechargeable battery?
these people are looking for a fight that isn't there.

[BlueDjinn]

I have no idea about the facts and claims tossed back & forth between this group and Jobs, but regarding the "how many tons have you recycled" bit, here's how these numbers compare:
"1,500 tons in the past year" = about 29 tons per week for Apple.
"5,000 tons in the past 6 weeks" = about 833 tons per week for HP.
So, HP supposedly has recycled about 28 times as much hardware as Apple--but let's consider a few rather important factors:
--first, HP sells a good 7 times the number of computers that Apple does worldwide (according to the 2005 Q1 figures)
--What does HP sell? Huge tower systems, heavy servers, and laptops averaging 7-10 lbs each
--What does Apple sell? Thin iMacs, tiny Mac minis, and laptops averaging 5-7 lbs each. Their PowerMac and eMac sales have only made up a small fraction of their sales over the past year.
Given all of this, it's hardly surprising that HP has recycled a LOT more waste than Apple--because they PRODUCE a lot more!!
This isn't to say that Apple shouldn't work to improve their recycling/environmental program, but it's a silly argument to use.

[SnakeBoy]

Who give a rat's behind if prisoners are disassembling apple products? Not me.

[aestival]

In reply to:

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"Even small amounts of lead can be very, very harmful," said the SVTC response. "And because the iPod is so small, it is much more likely to get tossed into the trash (instead of recycled) and end up in the landfill."

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This is the sort of nonsense rhetoric that serves to undermine real environmental improvement. There is a definite minimum to the amount of lead that can be "very, very harmful", and unlike many other environmental contaminants, lead occurs widely in nature. There are many real enviornmental issues, from global warming to toxic waste, on scales far larger than the lead in every iPod ever produced combined.
Now, if you'll excuse me I must go back to being radioactive (natural potassium) while producing copious quantities of greenhouse gas (breathing). Oh yes, and continuing to use my iPod, which apparently is an environmental plus (three years and still running fine -- must be a green iPod).

[elCapiton]

So after being shot down about Apple using prison labour(who really cares about that anyways) and shipping stuff overseas, they say that it's not really Apple but some recycling companies doing this. BUT, Apple should still be at fault for every Apple product ever made. Give me break!
If these people really want to make an impact why not try and get companies to reduce their energy consumption. There are so many companies using cooling towers just dumping heat out the roof while burning fossil fuels at the same time to heat the buildings. That's a huge waste and has a much bigger impact than any iPods.

[fribhey]

you also have to consider that not only does HP sell computers but they also sell printers, scanners, PDAs, CD/DVD burners, etc, etc. - hardware that apple no longer sells. most everyone i know either owns an epson or HP printer AND people go through printers much faster then computers.

[osxfoundry]

What a shame for this Environment Group!
I just wonder who is managing this group and how smart he is ?
I would tell that person that instead of wasting his time going after Apple (who has become an icon for youth) that he should concentrate on more important issues !! And trust me, there tons !!
I challenge that person to go after our current Administration who has been, since it took power, neglecting Environment policies and behaving like "I don't care about our environment because US is the king of the world" and like "I don't care about our children future because I'm in power, I make money, and I'll be dead when the earth becomes a trash can".
So please, Mister CEO, President, or whatever your title, be smart and lead your group like it should be
lead (and don't worry, there is no "lead" in lead.).

[NeoX]

I echo the other words here... Of course HP recycles more, they produce more stuff then Apple does. They sell a lot of boat anchor type disposable computers, not to mention the line of printers they sell. Apple does not sell printers any longer. Apple computers have a much longer useful life then the PC world. Up untill a few months ago I still had several older Pre-G3 PowerMacs. All of them found new homes and are still in use.
Jobs said that Apple does not use Prisoners. So what if they did? I would think taking computers apart is a lot more fun then pressing License Plates or cleaning up crap on the side of the road! /forums/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif
They claim that according to their contacts Prisoners have indeed recycled Apple Computers. This does not mean that this came from Apple. There are recycle centers all over the country that take old computers. How do they know it isn't one of these recyclers?
If they want to save the environment, which I think at this point only GOD can do, then why not go after factories, old automobiles and Diesel trucks that spew out the number one carcinogens that we breath everyday...
NeoX
--
This Message made with 100% recycled Pixels

[funkboy]

Outstanding article, Jim!
This definitely shed some light on the claims levied against Apple, and how strange some of them are.
I feel this group is just attacking Apple to get publicity... many of their claims are ridiculous even in this rebuttal. I could argue that used oil from a lawnmower, because it's smaller than a car, is much more likely to be poured down the drain than poured in a pail and brought in to a proper waste disposal center. Responsible people will know the batteries should probably be disposed of differently - honestly, how many people dump a computer (or $300 electronic gadget) right into the garbage?
It may be time to start ignoring these people so they go away - I don't want this getting ugly for Apple.

[fahlman]

Here's a page, Apple - Environment, on Apple's website where you can find about Apple and the environment including information about Policies, Product Design, Facilities, Recycling and additional Resources. The Energy Usage Calculator on the Resources page is interesting.