[MacCheetah3]

Hi
I do understand. I don't mind those that borrow CDs -- And I know you really meant borrow. I was just saying that consumers, artists, ... could easily make laws, ... that would work out for all. The RIAA has some good points but I'd honestly say they are really starting to take this whole thing too far.
I'm just saying that I don't understand those trying to argue P2P is right or is like free advertising. BS! I will admit I have and do use P2P on occasion. Has to be way less than 1% of my very occasional [P2P] use for audio downloads but I still do. While still 'wrong'...I'll say it again...It is much easier and willful for me to go out and purchase a 12-15 track audio CD for ~$15 than pay thousands or even numerous hundreds of dollars for things like software. Don't go out to eat one time and you'll save enough for a music CD. Sheesh! Heck, the same can be said for DVDs.

[JCW]

My name is also Jeff I thought you were addressing my post, until I realized you would of addressed me as JCW and that Jeff signed his post. Now I understand
I 'm reminded of Gilder Radner's SNL quote "Never Mind"

[MacCheetah3]

Hi
/forums/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif
No problem.

[lkalliance]

In reply to:

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I'm a perfect example of the other side of the coin insofar as my having downloaded and listened to music available in P2P networks has led me to discover new and vast treasure troves of music that I would never otherwise have known about -- and as a result I have purchased CDs of artists heretofore unknown to me. These are purchases which were brought about by P2P rather than undermined by it.

---

I've heard this argument before and it always sounds like rationalization to me. Perhaps I'm tainted because I believe that MOST P2P sharing does not fall into this category, and I don't really have proof of that.
But marketing is done at the discretion of the marketed, and not the marketer. If I assume that you're completely in touch with your decisionmaking and all the factors that go into it, and that your P2P experience is in fact a benefit to the music industry, that still doesn't make it all right (though I suppose it makes it more benign)...because the music industry has decided it doesn't want to face the risks of that kind of marketing. You're still doing something they've decided they don't want done with their property. It's playing with house money...against the house's wishes.

[jmincey]

"It's playing with house money...against the house's wishes."
When you play with the "house money" which belongs to another party, then that party has less money than it would have had. But for this to translate to the P2P realm, then my download would have to replace a purchase which -- absent the option to download -- I otherwise would have made.
If I download a music file which ultimately doesn't appeal to me and which I never listen to, I fail to see how this deprives any third party of revenue to which they are entitled.

[lkalliance]

I was inappropriately glib and used the wrong phrase, and I should know better.
What I mean is to take this beyond looking at the specifics of your case, and into the larger realm of risk. The RIAA has decided that the benefit of the kind of marketing you're talking about is not worth the cost that P2P overall brings to it, and thus would prefer not to do that kind of marketing.
When someone says, "I should be able to fileshare because it gets me to buy things that I otherwise wouldn't buy" then he's making a marketing decision on behalf of the RIAA -- or at least he's claiming to to rationalize the sharing. But he's not assuming any of the risk of that decision. That's what I was trying to encapsulate with my remark.


EDIT / ADDENDUM:
Back on the direct topic of this thread, I'm appalled that the RIAA would want to make ripping CD's illegal. Backups are one part of it, but I'm more concerned about space shifting. I haven't listened to a CD in years...I'm always at my computer, I much prefer to listen via iTunes. While I am definitely against filesharing and while I've not been overly bemused at the RIAA's message up until now, this is insanity.