[MW Forums]

Cider is TransGaming's new Windows translation layer technology that will enable Windows games to run on Intel Macs without installing Windows first, or requiring a reboot. more

[roadwarrior]

Oooh, nifty!! Can't say that a 15% drop in the framerates on the kinds of games I'm likely to play on my laptop will hurt too much, especially on my MacBook Pro 2GHz, so I'm all for it. Bring it on!!!

[derbazooka]

That can't be good for traditional Mac game porters. Their business will dry up as the Power PC base dwindles over time.
Is there any reason why they couldn't do this for any type of Windows app, not just games?

[montgomery_burns]

What will the installation process be like for these games? Do Mac users have to click on Windows .exe files or will they come with native Mac installers? Will we see these Windows games asking to put stuff in C:Program Files or asking to add Start Menu items when run on the Mac?
Will the game companies provide actual Mac documentation and technical support for these games, or will they just tell Mac users that they are on their own?

[Grendelmon]

This can't be good for Mac game developers/porters. Especially if PC developers are directly involved with adding native support to Cider.
What incentive will PC developement companies have to contract/in-house ports to the Mac?

[Peter Cohen]

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Is there any reason why they couldn't do this for any type of Windows app, not just games?

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As the name of their company implies, TransGaming is specifically focused on translation layer technology for gaming, not for general applications. CrossOver, which is mentioned in the article, is another WINE derivative more specifically focused on business applications.

[Peter Cohen]

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What will the installation process be like for these games? Do Mac users have to click on Windows .exe files or will they come with native Mac installers?

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I have not yet used a Cider-enabled game, but my impression from Vikas Gupta is that the game is essentially encapsulated, providing the exact same experience for the Mac user as the PC user is bound to get. Cedega, the parent technology used by Cider, takes care of InstallerShield weirdness and other things in a fairly friendly and straightforward manner, but once again, this is a Windows application -- just without the cruft and separate operating system shell produced by Boot Camp or Parallels.

[daddydoodaa]

This is a good thing. It's going to increase the appeal of Mac and offer more choice to users.
Games operate in their own "universe" on your computer - it isn't like you move data back and forth between TextEdit and "Game Z".
Congratulations to TransGaming for figuring this out. I hope they move a lot of games and make truckloads of money.
Rock on!
daddydoodaa

[Steve_S]

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That can't be good for traditional Mac game porters. Their business will dry up as the Power PC base dwindles over time.

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That depends if this model ever becomes successful or not. It seems like the number of Mac ports has been dwindling as it is, so I'm not sure how much of a big deal this would be anyway. It also depends on whether or not people willing to accept the peformance hit. Performance is critical in games. Hard core gamers (albeit usually not Mac users) often spend thousands of dollars just trying to get an extra 10 - 20% performance increase.
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 Is there any reason why they couldn't do this for any type of Windows app, not just games? 

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Games are different than most other applications. When you're playing a game, you are usually playing in full screen mode and the behavior of the operating system is not readily apparent. When using other applications, the OS integration is very significant. Sometimes these difference manifest themselves in something like Cocoa services, Spotlight integration, iLife integration, etc. In short with games, the underlying OS is not very important, so long as the OS is stable. With regular applications, the underlying OS plays a big role in the user experience. You don't see a lot of people using X11 apps like the GIMP, etc. Instead, they'd rather use Photoshop for example.
Steve

[Peter Cohen]

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What incentive will PC developement companies have to contract/in-house ports to the Mac?

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As far as I'm concerned, the horse has already left the barn on this particular issue, and did a while ago. While there's still some original Mac game development, and specific games have been created simultaneously for the Mac and PC (Blizzard's World of Warcraft being a great example), it's few and far between.
Projects like Cider can assure Mac users they'll still be able to play games, and while it may come at the expense of some native Mac games, it should go a long way to resolving issues that Mac users have long grappled with, such as time to market, price and more.
And for those of us who want to wait, hopefully Mac game publishers like Aspyr will continue to bring key titles to the platform -- presuming Mac users will buy them in any sort of quantity.

[richcon]

If it creates a perfect Mac-like experience, then it won't be good for Mac-native game development at least, not initially.
But, I somehow doubt that games run through WINE will ever reach the speed or OS/Interface-integration that native games offer. Mac users want that integration.
Something like this may help grow the Mac's installed base, since the number one type of application available for PC in droves but not available (as much) for the Mac is gaming. Average users don't need more than 1 or 2 good office applications, 1 or 2 good home media applications, 1 or 2 good graphic design applications, and 1 or 2 good 3D modeling / editing / audio apps. But people do want more than 1 or 2 good games.
So, here's my prediction: Mac game developers don't see their business affected in any significant way at first, as companies already working with them will continue to for the competitive advantage native games provide, and companies who aren't turn to API-compatibility tools like Cider to start working on the Mac at a basic level. In the long run, as the Mac's gaming market grows and users start demanding better gaming experiences, more companies will then turn to native development to satisfy that market.

[horvatic]

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Cider is TransGaming's new Windows translation layer technology that will enable Windows games to run on Intel Macs without installing Windows first, or requiring a reboot. <a href="/news/2006/08/03/cider/index.php">[more]</a>

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I"ll believe it when I see it run games at normal speed using this translater. Typically what happens is things slow down to much and basically the game is unplayable. It will be interesting to see the reviews of this when it comes out.

[tallscot]

For 2D games, this is fine. For 3D, I'd rather just boot into Windows on another partition.
That being said, PC gaming is dying. The Xbox 360 titles are outselling PC titles already. Portable gaming is much bigger than PC gaming now.
So just as Mac users finally get the ability to run Windows games on their Macs, Windows gaming is becoming the Mac experience in that the most anticipated games come out for console first and may never get to PC.
Buy a Dell LCD and switch between your console and your Mac. /forums/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

[swartzfeger]

This makes next week's rumored WWDC Mac Pro rollout even more interesting. There are about a 1000+ PC games I need to catch up on. /forums/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif