[sdf]

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Apple has traditionally bent over backwards to help Mac users transition where the OS is concerned. Just as as the 68K code base and the original HFS file system were supported well into the PowerPC years, the Classic Mac OS has been supported up to the Intel transition and the PowerPC platform gets continued support despite the latter transition, it will be years before HFS support disappears.

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Aw, that's nuthin'. MFS survived in read/write form until 7.6.1, and read only until 8.0. Considering MFS was replaced in 1985...

(Of course, there's no way Apple would hold onto HFS for 14 years.)

[heisetax]

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Maybe this will sound as if I'm a bit cynical but I do not believe this was a mistake, this was an approved slip of the tongue to kick the interest up another notch for the WWDC presentation by the Steve.
OK, so I am a cynic, sosumi. /forums/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

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The way we find out is whether Steve Jobs goes the route he did with ATI & not mention or use ATI products in the new Maxs after a mention that Apple would use a new ATI video card in the new Macs.
This is almost the same. The only difference is that a video card can easilly be changed while a default file system would be harder to change.
We'll find out more very soon at WWDC 2007. With Intel mentioning their new products on a regular basis Steve Jobs should be getting used to not having al of the surprise surrounding Apple's adoption of new technologies in their new Macs & other products.
Bill the TaxMan

[JDW]

Jobs is known for punishing ignorance, stupidity and of course "leaks." I wouldn't be surprised to here Jobs on stage say, "...and we'll be doing it all on HFS+." Wouldn't that make Sun feel stupid! And of course, that's why Jobs has done such in the past. Regardless of the ethics of it or what we personally may feel about it (i.e., the need for a new file system), it would nevertheless be fun to see Jobs pound underlings into submission!

[mdawson]

I would be hard pressed to state that the Mac is in need of a new file system. HFS+ is hardly problematic and works as expected.

[SGP_MacUser]

Whole-heartedly agreeable with you.
I recall that Apple purchased Mode 32 from Connectix and gave it free to all Apple users so that they could bump up their 24-bit ROM to 32-bit ROM and benefit from System 7 32-bits features. (if I recall the facts accurately)
There are several besides these, Rossetta, etc.
Apple, we loyal users look up to your continued support.

[piccologato]

"Ouch!!"
NPNG
(no pain,,)

[nittany4]

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This is what I want from Leopard! This would be big. But I have my doubts it will be the default FS. But just in case, I'm going to prepare for a clean install.

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I'm with you. This would be great, but I have my doubts still. There are technical reasons for these doubts and even Sun has done a fair amount of back peddling since this information slip. The fact that ZFS was coming to the Mac was already known. Making it the default file system is another story.
Regarding the clean install, I always do that with a major release. For starters, it's a good thing to do every couple of years just to keep the system clean of garbage. It's a cheap and easy way of defragmenting your drive as well. Overall, there seem to be much less problems for people who take this route, despite the overhead of reinstalling the necessary applications.

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i agree when upgrading a wipe and clean install makes the most sense but
what do i do with eons of files? especially now that i have become an apple tv user and have a huge tv and movie library in my itunes folder along with my music

i wonder if this "time machine" will help move old data and then re-install it if you DO chose to wipe for ZFS??

[Steve_S]

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Jobs is known for punishing ignorance, stupidity and of course "leaks."

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How's he going to punish Sun? Threaten not to use their open source and superior file system? You have a little more leverage when you're giving money to a vendor. I'm not sure that applies here.

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Wouldn't that make Sun feel stupid!

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Why? HFS is perfectly suitable and dependable for Apple's needs. ZFS is better, but it's not like HFS isn't still a good fit. If Jobs' reason for ditching ZFS was because Sun stole his thunder, then it would be Jobs that looks stupid. However, if Apple never intended on using ZFS as the default file system, then Sun would look stupid.

[Steve_S]

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i wonder if this "time machine" will help move old data and then re-install it if you DO chose to wipe for ZFS??

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There's no magic here, even Time Machine requires another volume to do backups. Ideally, this would be done on an external HD. If you used the same physical drive, you could possibly just upgrade one partition to ZFS for the clean install.
Anyway, all of these discussions are moot until we find out what's going on on Monday. The developers are getting betas delivered to them on Monday. It's not like Apple would have the time or opportunity to do a ZFS (free) build of Leopard prior to the WWDC. Likewise, based on the developer build and what's announced, we'll find out if ZFS was ever meant to be the default file system or not.

[JDW]

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If Jobs' reason for ditching ZFS was because Sun stole his thunder, then it would be Jobs that looks stupid.

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Such a remark turns a blind eye to what Jobs and Apple has done in the past. Apple pursues anyone and everyone for what they deem "illegal leaks." And Jobs punished ATI in the past for revealing too much too soon, and Jobs did not come out looking stupid for it. Jobs is Jobs. And throwing fits and engaging in acts of retrobution are a part of his nature -- we all know that (if you don't, read some history).
So no, Jobs will not come out looking bad, no matter what he does. Jobs makes OTHERS look bad, never himself. I personally don't see this situation with Sun as being any different. Especially now that Sun is trying to reword its statements by saying "future versions of the OS." No, they are indeed in Job's hot water now.