[Macworld.com]

Once upon a time, Rob Griffiths asked Apple to involve itself more with third-party development for the iPhone. Now he just wants Apple to leave the third-party developers to their own devices. [more]

[moo083]

I mostly agree with you.
I do disagree about an Apple SDK. As long as they don't restrict things we have already come up with, I think it would be an improvement. Sure, us technical people install hacked in third party software, but unless its sanctioned by Apple, I don't think most people will have anything to do with this software, unless its blessed by Apple.
Another thing closer to my heart is that I am a programmer. However, the difficulty of just getting the development environment set up is overly complicated for the iPhone and I bet there would be a hell of a lot more iPhone developers if only it was as simple as coding for the Mac.
That said, if it never happens, it'll still be ok. The delopment environment will get easier to set up. Tutorials will show up. But Apple is about ease of use. New software would be a lot easier with Apple's involvement.
I hope all this software doesn't shrivel up and die, but I have a sneaking suspicion that it will not.

[ziggybop]

So, you're asking Apple to never update the OS on the iPhone?
Or, like Microsoft, provide a bloated OS with backward compatibility in perpetuity?
I'm sorry, but until there's an Apple SDK, you're takin' your chances with third-party software.

[griffman]

No, I'm asking Apple to not lock out third party developers with a software update. If things happen to break, then that's fine -- the third party developers will be able to make them work again. But if Apple takes proactive steps to stop third party developers, things will be much tougher.
And in all honesty, I'd love to see an official Apple iPhone SDK. But I just haven't seen much lately that indicates they're at all interested in such a thing. So lacking that, the solution we have today is quite workable. If an official kit comes along, that'd be wonderful.
-rob.

[trip1ex]

Er I think you're overestimating the usefulness of the 3rd party software so far. I really haven't seen much that I will use except the ringtone generator. And when an update breaks it then I will just wonder why I didn't spend a $1 per ringtone the official way. Time is money.
Also are you really going to play Zork?
"But I have yet to experience any sort of total iPhone lockup, and all of the Apple-provided applications are still working perfectly."
My hacked phone hasn't behaved differently that I can tell, but all Apple-provided Apps working perfectly? Well I wouldn't have said 'working perfectly.' I would have same working the same as before. You can't tell me Safari doesn't crash at least a few times a day for you and that the Ipod app doesn't quit while surfing most of the time (eventually.) This has been the case for me on different iPhones purchased months apart.

[montgomery_burns]

What kind of support do people expect to get when they install third party applications on the iPhone? How can third party developers support their users when Apple doesn't officially support the developers?

[MacPro]

Quote:

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You can't tell me Safari doesn't crash at least a few times a day for you and that the Ipod app doesn't quit while surfing most of the time (eventually.) This has been the case for me on different iPhones purchased months apart.

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I don't know if Rob can tell you, but I can. No, my Safari doesn't crash. Neither does my iPod app.
I do have a question for Rob or anyone who's installed some of these apps. How much space do they take up?

[JMStafford]

Quote:

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Er I think you're overestimating the usefulness of the 3rd party software so far. I really haven't seen much that I will use except the ringtone generator.

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Operative word, so far.
Remember the work that goes into these hacks will be what lays the groundwork for that absolutely essentially salesforce tool that some company will develop in-house and deploy to all their reps using what is absolutely the cheapest portable computer in the world.
And who knows what some programmer far more inventive than I will come up with in the not-so distant future.

[griffman]

The larger point is that all of this happened within 75 days or so, without any help from Apple. But as for the usefulness of the apps, I find quite a few of them very useful. Yes, I do play Zork -- it's a great timewaster when I'm stuck on a train or a plane. I use the screenshot app when writing about the iPhone. I use VNC and ssh to get to my Macs to do things (like start downloads, etc.). I participate in a couple of IRC channels, and I basically live in iChat on my Mac, so the chat app is important.
As for stability, I haven't seen any of the crashes you're describing -- but then again, you may be doing things with your phone that I'm not doing with mine. I'm a simplistic iPod user: enable shuffle, press Play, and that's basically it. And Safari is used to access my usual sites, and none of them seem to cause any issues.
-rob.

[griffman]

"I do have a question for Rob or anyone who's installed some of these apps. How much space do they take up?"
As I recall, when I first installed the installer, it told me I had about 125MB available for apps. That figure today is at 95MB with about 20 different things installed.
-rob.

[rgonzalez]

why not an application to move applications in/out of the iPhone that you can install to the iPod Touch for example...and/or "Beam" an application via WiFi to another iPhone device to share it..or maybe Apache which I read was ported to the Iphone and run something like RUMPUS so others (alloed) could "browse" and download whatever is permited into their device !
This application hints will blast into deep space the iPhone ussability/capabilities.
Another thing I do not read in all this blogs is what tools can be used or are required to design and program an application for the iPhone...a lot of talk on the applications itself but not howto's...
share your thoughts !
great work you all !

[rgerdes]

Hey Rob, I have a Treo and one of things I miss the most is the To-Do list and a little app called Handy Shopper, which made errands and shopping easy. I scanned the list of third party apps but did not see a To-Do function. I miss the alarms for To-Dos too, and how you could snooze them. Any 3rd party solution for that?

[PSM]

Right now I will be first on line to buy a 2G iPhone whenever it comes out. If Apple does anything to intentionally prevent or hinder 3rd party development, I will not buy one. End of story. Based solely on the features it has out of the box, I can't justify the loss of productivity from replacing my Treo.

[drimwit]

This reminds me of the Windows on Mac situation. Apple underestimated the demand, hackers sprang forth with a solution, Apple, doing the calculus for how their platform is percieved, decided they were better showing their hand and providing the functionality people wanted.
Similarly, Apple is no doubt doing something about third party apps, they'd be nuts not to, but with hackers grasping the nettle they may be forced to announce their intentions sooner so they can control their platform. Apple is a big company, it doesn't move very fast.
Personally, I like how the iPhone is panning out. Free, open development makes the platform really attractive. The hardware will be fixed at some point soon. You can unlock the phone. Pricing is more sensible. I can see alot of people coming to this platform, and it really taking off.