[kevrev]

I've been watching the 3rd-party app hacking with a lot of interest. At this point its more of a 'proof-of-concept' thing than something I'm going to actually install. Maybe I'll change my mind after Leopard comes out and we hopefully get Apple provided features like syncing notes & to-do's.
More than anything though it kinda shows how far Apple HASN'T gone with this amazing piece of technology. There are so many different apps that were created that add great functionality and help the iPhone more closely rival the feature set found in many of the standard smartphones out there. Webapps just don't cut it. EDGE isn't as horrible as I thought but it's still too slow to make me want to run to these sites that require reloading a detailed page ... especially when a similar 'program' can be permanently installed.
While so far I have only been watching from a distance I hope the 3rd-party hacking continues no matter what obstacles Apple puts in their way. There's obviously so much more the iPhone can do to let it be crippled for political reasons or corporate deals. As an Apple loyalist I would appreciate it if the folks in Cupertino remember who they are and who they represent in the Tech world.
my 2 cents

[AGENice]

It doesn't matter whether hacking the iPhone bricks it with this current up date or not. It COULD happen in the future.
Who knows what these 3rd party apps are doing to the iPhone. Who knows if they will screw something up so bad, that even a fresh install of the latest update won't fix it.
As I said before, I'd rather go with a version that definitely won't mess up my $400 elegant piece of hardware.
You feel free about hacking it and having to worry anytime an update comes out.

[Chris Breen]

You have a valid point and I understand why people would want to stay away from third-party apps given the 1.1.1 update and its repercussions. We have no way of predicting what Apple will do in its next updates. But it's helpful to understand that the approach to installing and using third-party apps and unlocking the phone are completely different kinds of technical issues.
The unlock stuff mucks with firmware in a serious way. Third-party apps behave much more like the iPhone's legitimate applications. If you have a problem, you remove them with AppTapp. If an iPhone update comes out that you prize more than you 3rd party apps, it's a trivial matter to restore the phone to its default state with the software version currently running on the iPhone and then update the iPhone with the new software.
Again, who knows what Apple has in mind (personally, I hope it's an SDK so I can have all these apps "blessed" by Apple), but currently third-party apps are not a danger to the iPhone.

[griffman]

"It doesn't matter whether hacking the iPhone bricks it with this current up date or not. It COULD happen in the future."
While anything is possible (hey, a pig just flew by the window!), it is highly unlikely that third party apps will turn ones iPhone into a brick. What most people seem to be missing here is that there is a huge difference between third party iPhone apps and the unlocking programs. The unlocking programs modify your phone -- permanently. The applications are just that -- applications. An analogy would be to say that those who install and run Tinker Tool (which lets you modify some behind-the-scenes prefs in OS X) risk "bricking" their Macs because it's not Apple-approved software. Rubbish. What they risk -- potentially -- is making their installed version of OS X unusable. (Note: I'm using Tinker Tool as an example -- it really CANNOT do anything bad to your machine!).
Similarly, iPhone apps might crash your iPhone. They may even make it so that it may not work in its current state. But that is not the same as the "bricking" that those who have unlocked iPhones are experiencing. If your iPhone locks up with a third party app, you can remove the third party app. If it's still not working right, you can run a Restore in iTunes and get it back to a factory fresh state.
Those who have unlocked their iPhones cannot do a software restore to return to a pristine state. Those of us with third party apps can do so any time we like. (I've done it many times, due to wanting to test something, or do a before-and-after screenshot, etc.).
But even then, you don't have to do that. Jason Snell had an iPhone with third party apps on it. I sat right next to him as he connected his phone (with the apps installed) and ran the 1.1.1 updater. It worked perfectly. Yes, his third party apps were wiped out, but his phone wasn't bricked, and all the new features worked fine.
"Who knows what these 3rd party apps are doing to the iPhone. Who knows if they will screw something up so bad, that even a fresh install of the latest update won't fix it."
Who knows what third party applications are doing to OS X? The main difference is that Apple does offer an SDK to help with OS X development, but that doesn't mean everyone's using it or following the rules -- Unsanity has made a very good business out of helping people do things to their systems that Apple intentionally didn't allow. Should anyone running an Unsanity application have their hardware warranty voided as well, and be considered at risk of turning their Mac Pro into a lump of steel and wire?
"As I said before, I'd rather go with a version that definitely won't mess up my $400 elegant piece of hardware."
And that's your choice. Chris and I have chosen to go with apps that run when we're offline, that offer full background functionality, that let us customize the look of our phones, and that provide solutions that are not available from Apple or as web apps.
"You feel free about hacking it and having to worry anytime an update comes out."
I don't worry. So far, I've just chosen not to update. I'll update to 1.1.1 once the bright folks figure out how to get the apps working and make it as easy as it is with 1.0.2. Then I'll stay on 1.1.1 until the same thing happens with 1.1.2, etc. To each his or her own.
Why so much anger at those who wish to use their phones differently than others?
-rob.

[ged]

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Web apps have their place but they have their limits -- requiring that you're connected to the web being the primary one.

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Thank you. That is the main reason I had installed 3rd party apps - there are plenty of times when I do not have access to WiFi or a cell signal. Hard to believe, I know, but true.
Plus, even when I am connected, it just seems silly to open a browser, open bookmarks, navigate to the right bookmark folder, click the bookmark, wait for the app to load (which can be pretty long when using edge networking) -- all just so I can get to my to-do or shopping list. /forums/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused.gif

[Craig_A]

"When it comes to security, you may be your own worst enemy. What puts you at risk is not so much the firewall, antivirus, or other security software you do (or dont) use as much as the bad habits you may have picked up. Careless computing puts your data, and even your identity, at risk."
I remember just reading this somewhere. Where was that, again? I wouldn't want to lose that attribution. /forums/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

[BruisedApple]

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Why so much anger at those who wish to use their phones differently than others?

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Because we have to listen to you people whine about it when it doesnt work because you're not using the phone the way it was meant to be used.
Because people cant get it through their heads that if you dont like the iPhone and it doesnt do what you want it to do, then go buy a different frigg'n phone.
Because all of the sudden geeks put Apple on a pedestal that somehow represented free-thinking EULA violating hackers and pirates. When most people enjoyed the ease-of-use approach and why we love Apple products in the first place.

[Chris Breen]

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Because we have to listen to you people whine about it when it doesnt work because you're not using the phone the way it was meant to be used.

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There's a very simple answer to this one, BA. If you don't care for the subject or opinions, read something else. No one is holding a gun to your head.

[ged]

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Why so much anger at those who wish to use their phones differently than others?

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Because people cant get it through their heads that if you dont like the iPhone and it doesnt do what you want it to do, then go buy a different frigg'n phone.

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And apparently some people can't get it through their heads that if you don't like the subject of an article, and it doesn't say what you want it to, then go read some other frigg'n article.
Believe it or not, MacWorld does still have plenty of articles that are not about iPhone hacks.

[Craig_A]

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Believe it or not, MacWorld does still have plenty of articles that are not about iPhone hacks.

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Absolutely! I'm eagerly waiting for the one about installing Leopard on a Dell.

[BruisedApple]

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Absolutely! I'm eagerly waiting for the one about installing Leopard on a Dell.

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Then Macworld will write articles, videos, and podcasts complaining about mean-ole-Apple when 10.5.1 breaks it.

[Chris Breen]

Seems to me that if you could install OS X on a PC that would be an article of interest, no?
It's pretty simple. If you want to read about only those subjects that Apple approves of, Apple has a wonderful website. However, we like to present information that has a broader range. Again, if you don't care for it, read something else.

[edmetric]

As you said before, Mr. Breen, the posts are not personal. Ideas from anyone from either side are open for consideration. If a snake, however, wanders into a mongoose camp, it's just another meal. /forums/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smirk.gif Let me also note, since I'm a beet farmer, if someone will eat beets they will do anything. /forums/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif
Ideas and points of view have the force of a wind. Some are gentle breezes. Some raise a storm. Enjoy them all...if you enjoy all this down home nature hokum. /forums/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

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Sorry, Ken, you missed the point. I meant that ANYONE -- well intentioned and not so -- can suggest that they have a point of view worth considering. To suggest that only snake oil salesman offer a peek behind the curtain is silly.

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[thgd]

Are we supposed to be impressed by the applications shown in this video ?
Adding ugly, cramped interfaces or marginal productivity apps looks like a waste of time to me, especially in light of losing their functionality every time the iPhone is updated.
Is there such a dearth of worthwhile Mac subjects that your editors now need to report on and encourage illegitimate hacking ?