[MacCheetah3]

Hi
THe GMA950 is farely capable of most graphics needs. It doesn't have hardware T&L processing but that's not normally leveraged overly in GUIs.

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The GMA 950 shares the same architectural weakness as the GMA 900: no hardware geometry processing. Neither basic (DX7) hardware transform and lighting.[1], nor more advanced vertex shaders (DX8 and later) are handled in the GMA hardware.

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I would think the GMA950 would have little struggle with the Leopard GUI but I could be mistaken.

[Cloudmover]

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So will this produce some slowdown on the macs with integrated Intel graphics when compared to Tiger?

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I suspect it will be the same as Tiger, i.e. Core Image will be supported, but only for non-real-time processing. If you have no real need for the real-time effects -- and most people don't -- Leopard should be fine; you just won't get all the "pretty things".

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That's what I thought. However, Logic Studio with the stock G4 GPU was, to say the least, laughable. Move a menu, click a button, close a window - every graphical element in Logic Studio jumped from one position to another. It was like looking at movie at 8 frames per second (instead of the standard 24).
The new GPU made everything smooth again.
I think this is only something us G4 owners should be concerned about. You Intel Mac guys will be fine because you have a much faster processor to begin with.
BTW I'm using Logic Studio as my personal benchmark because it's the newest Apple pro app collection, my G4 system barely qualifies and the Logic GUI is filled with Leopardesque "pretty transparent things."
Edit - added this info---
To all the G4 owners & anyone who doesn't know -
You can check if Core Image is supported by your GPU by going to the Apple Menu on the top left and clicking through
About this Mac - More Info - Hardware - Graphics/Displays
You can get a list of Apple approved Core Image GPUs on the lower right here
http://www.apple.com...ures/coreimage/

[SRASLAN]

Is there a Bargin price for pre-ordering?? Possibly implied by TOMTOM's statement: /forums/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif
"The Apple Online Store is open - with pre-order for Leopard - bargain price."

[TheBum]

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I suspect it will be the same as Tiger, i.e. Core Image will be supported, but only for non-real-time processing. If you have no real need for the real-time effects -- and most people don't -- Leopard should be fine; you just won't get all the "pretty things".

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That's what I thought. However, Logic Studio with the stock G4 GPU was, to say the least, laughable. Move a menu, click a button, close a window - every graphical element in Logic Studio jumped from one position to another. It was like looking at movie at 8 frames per second (instead of the standard 24).
The new GPU made everything smooth again.

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You are not the typical user, though, and you admit having the slowness issues in Tiger. There are many users that have been running Tiger on G4 machines and have been getting along just fine. For those people, I'm sure Leopard will not be much, if any, worse than Tiger. That was the point I was trying to make.

[bastion]

Tiger did NOT have a minimum CPU speed requirement like Leopard does.
Tiger did not have an explicit minimum CPU speed, but it did have an implicit one based on some of the other requirements. (300MHz desktop, 466MHz iBook, G4/400 PowerBook.) I think it's unlikely that Leopard really honest-and-for-true requires a single 867MHZ or faster, but won't cope with the slightly slower 1x800MHz machines, the in-some-cases-better 2x533, or the almost always better 2x800. Much more likely is that there was some other change introduced coincident with the QS that is required but is too esoteric to list for general users. It might legitimately be too slow to recommend for general use on a stock 733 QS.

[mr_rsu]

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Whoa ... The retail version is the same price as usual at $129 but the Education price is $116!
Didn't the previous edu versions cost something like $79? Seems Apple is getting stingy with the college discounts. I could understand when they dropped the edu price on iPods because they dropped the price for everyone but that's not the case here.
Ok, I admit it ... Apple is GREEDY! /forums/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif

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How much Apple is paying its in-house programmers, developers, designers, administrative employees, public relation/marketing types, executives and so on nowadays?
How much expenses Apple are paying to keep its huge software and hardware operations going on and complying with federal, state, legal, business and environment regulations? What about distribution/shipping expenses? Outside contractors (cleaning services, landscaping, etc)?
How much Apple is paying sales employees, telecom employees and tech support kids to help customers make purchasing decisions or seek technical solutions?
How much Apple is paying to creative media/advertising and marketing firms? Consultation firms? Legal firms? Accounting/auditing firms? Massaging firms?
There are federal and state taxes Apple have to pay. There are health and dental benefits Apple have to pay for their employees.
How much Apple is paying Steve Jobs nowadays? One buck? Do you think Apple should do it all for free for everyone?
In a perfect world, yes. But in California? Wow, everything's so expensive there! /forums/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cool.gif

[whitedog]

Nope, no Classic support in Leopard. If you need Classic, your best choice would probably be to get a refurbished G5 from Apple (if you don't already have one). Or, hold on to your old Mac for Classic and get a new Intel Mac for Leopard. Another alternative would be to partition the hard drive (or use two drives) on a PPC Mac and install Tiger with Classic on one partition and Leopard on the other. Again, a G5 is a good choice because it has better graphics support than most G4s - an important issue in Leopard which, like Vista, has steep video requirements.

[daniel2828_MW]

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Grrrrrrrrdid you follow the instructions as notified on http://www.apple.com...ne/storecredit/ ?

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UPDATE... Figured it out, had to apply for a 2nd code & get it through my iPhone (don't know why), then the Apple store makes it impossible to claim the money. Geez, You have to actually change your billing info, erase a credit card, add a gift card, then add BACK your original credit card to pay the balance just to get the transaction to go through and get your deserved credit!

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If you applied for your credit on or around the 14th of September, the process wasn't working correctly at the time and your Apple Store credit number and PIN probably won't work. You need to apply for a new Apple Store credit number and PIN at the link noted above. Then go to the Apple Store, place your order, and on the billing info page, click to update your payment method. You'll find a place there to enter the Apple Store credit number and PIN. I didn't have to remove and then replace my real credit card information.

[RASTERMAN]

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UPDATE... Figured it out, had to apply for a 2nd code & get it through my iPhone (don't know why), then the Apple store makes it impossible to claim the money. Geez, You have to actually change your billing info, erase a credit card, add a gift card, then add BACK your original credit card to pay the balance just to get the transaction to go through and get your deserved credit!
What a Mongolian cluster-F
Not very good policy Apple! Shame on you Steve Jobs. You're earning your cheap car salesman reputation more and more every day and I'm an Apple FANBOY! :-(

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Other than selecting "Change Payment Method" I had none of the issues you are describing.
I simply entered the Credit Number and PIN where indicated, clicked continue, and the credit was applied. $100 Apple Store Credit, $XX applied to my Credit Card on file. There was no need to reenter any credit card or billing info.
It does not get a lot easier than that.
Cheers!
---RASTER

[Schneb]

If the Apple Store gets you down, price wise, go to Amazon instead. It's $109 there with free shipping and NO California Sales Tax!! So I canceled my order with Apple, and preordered at Amazon instead.

[TheBum]

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If the Apple Store gets you down, price wise, go to Amazon instead. It's $109 there with free shipping and NO California Sales Tax!! So I canceled my order with Apple, and preordered at Amazon instead.

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The Family Pack is down to $189 at Amazon.com; a couple of hours ago, it was still at $199.

[Cloudmover]

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I suspect it will be the same as Tiger, i.e. Core Image will be supported, but only for non-real-time processing. If you have no real need for the real-time effects -- and most people don't -- Leopard should be fine; you just won't get all the "pretty things".

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That's what I thought. However, Logic Studio with the stock G4 GPU was, to say the least, laughable. Move a menu, click a button, close a window - every graphical element in Logic Studio jumped from one position to another. It was like looking at movie at 8 frames per second (instead of the standard 24).
The new GPU made everything smooth again.

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You are not the typical user, though, and you admit having the slowness issues in Tiger. There are many users that have been running Tiger on G4 machines and have been getting along just fine. For those people, I'm sure Leopard will not be much, if any, worse than Tiger. That was the point I was trying to make.

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Hi. /forums/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif
Ummm, Tiger runs BEAUTIFULLY on my machine as well. No slowness issues at all.
The ONLY app that was weird and wonky was the new Logic 8 and that has been cleared up by a new GPU. I'm sorry if I didn't make that clearer.
As Bastion states Leopard requires at least a "PowerPC G4 (867MHz or faster) processor."
From Apple Insider

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... engineers for the company recently determined that Leopard installs on 800MHz PowerPC G4 systems ran "too slow." Support for those systems was subsequently pulled from the most recent pre-release copies of Leopard, which inform testers that the software "cannot be installed" on those computers.

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Since we G4 users are already at the bottom of the qualification list , I still think that a simple, inexpensive (about $200.00) GPU upgrade would be prudent. If Core Image is to believed (and I have no reason not to believe in the technology) it will lessen the work the CPU does in order to run the graphics.
Like it or not Leopard is chockfull of eye candy. So much, in fact, that I think the old stock G4 GPUs would choke and turn the OS into molasses. I don't want my CPUs to have to do all that extra work to run the new GUI.
Hey, it couldn't hurt. /forums/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif

[TxTom]

Wrong. One version of Leopard. One version of Leopard. Trying to say that they're the same is like trying to say that Vista (any version) is the same as Windows NT/WinServer 2XXXX and they are NOT.
I use Tiger as present and run a server with Tiger Server on it. They are very different Tigers.
What you try and state is that there are multiple versions of Leopard and there are not. The family pack is a different LICENSE for the same version that runs the same either way. Same features just different licenses. The differences in Vista are VERY apparent. You add features with more money. Leopard, you get ALL the features with any license you buy.

[hohome]

Ok so on the 26th, do I go to the Apple Store-- 60 miles away, or D/L it? Also is iLife 08 included, or will I have to pay $99.00 and $258.00 to have Leopard and iLife installed on this iMac, and my MacBook Pro???? hohome11@.mac