[SeanoVox]

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While agree that they should have perhaps thought it through a bit more, remember that the 360 came out a full year before the PS3. I don't think at that time, it was feasible to include an HDDVD drive in the 360, it would have been cost prohibitive.
That said there is nothing stopping them now from revising the 360 again, to include an HDDVD drive built-in to the 360. But I still don't think it is necessary as the 360 was designed first and foremost as a game system. There are no 360 games on HDDVD and I don't think it is necessary, at this time.
Don't get me wrong, I wouldn't trade my PS3 for anything, actually the opposite, I did sell my elite to buy a PS3, before the elite price drop and after the PS3 60GB Price Drop. So I got it at the right time. Now that the 360 Pro systems are cheaper and include two games, I may pick one up again, as the 360 really is a fun system too.

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The 360 was rushed out 1 year early to beat sony to market, it wasn't done (see RROD) and that is why HD-DVD was an add-on, because yes you are right it was too expensive at the time, but MS will NEVER make games on HD-DVD because they wont want to shut out the early adopters. so you will see more games on 3 or 4 DVD's as time goes on, but that goes back to what I said about MS being a software company. Playing HD movies is just an added benefit, not having to switch discs in a game is the real reward.

[wgfinley]

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[
Because $600 is overpriced for a game console, regardless of how much it cost to make. In addition, the vast majority of PS3 titles just flat out suck. Tell me why I should shell out $600 for a console with a weak library when I can get a 360 with a much stronger library for less?

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I got the PS3 because it was the cheapest Blu-ray player on the market at the time I purchased it in early spring. It also got great reviews from several home theater magazines as a Blu-ray player. It has this cool thing that plays games built-in too and I've found those fun /forums/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif
Yes, you could get an Xbox and you could pray you don't get the ring of death or watch it spontaneously meltdown before your eyes (okay, slight exaggeration). Frankly I'm tired of the whining over how much it was, it's been a great Blu-ray player for me, has had timely updates and does everything it's supposed to very well. Gaming software will come as the platform matures.

[Ponceno]

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The 360 was rushed out 1 year early to beat sony to market, it wasn't done (see RROD) and that is why HD-DVD was an add-on, because yes you are right it was too expensive at the time, but MS will NEVER make games on HD-DVD because they wont want to shut out the early adopters. so you will see more games on 3 or 4 DVD's as time goes on, but that goes back to what I said about MS being a software company. Playing HD movies is just an added benefit, not having to switch discs in a game is the real reward.

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The Xbox 360 as a High Definition game system make more sense with a HD-DVD drive build-in. But because the Toshiba HD-DVD was not ready until April of 2006, missing the original target date of Christmas 2005 the release it with DVD drive only and also they don't use a HDMI port at the beginning.
Microsoft has a much money as Sony so the can afford having the HD-DVD from the beginning but was not willing to wait for being 1 year ahead of the PS3. Also they try to make the exterior to look slim and cool that not enough cooling was inside the case that we get the Red Ring of Dead, that show a rush to market the machine and now the are paying for it.

[NeoX]

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Microsoft has a much money as Sony so the can afford having the HD-DVD from the beginning but was not willing to wait for being 1 year ahead of the PS3. Also they try to make the exterior to look slim and cool that not enough cooling was inside the case that we get the Red Ring of Dead, that show a rush to market the machine and now the are paying for it.

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It is amazing that there wasn't the right amount of cooling on each component. The newer models have an additional heat-sink on one of the components. It's hard to believe they botched up the cooling considering how loud the console is.

[MacCheetah3]

Hi
Uh...The optical drive is most of the noise. It's not silent but not bad at all when playing arcade games off the HDD. I highly doubt the PS3 is silent. The biggest difference in audible noise is likely that all PS3s have HDDs to cache so the game disc can spin down; the disc doesn't spin down in the 360 unless you are in the Dashboard or playing an arcade game. I'm willing to admit there are shortcomings to the 360 and Wii, including the 360 failure rate -- though mine has been running ~14 months strong -- but let's not toss non-factual information into the stew.
P.S. I tried to record it but couldn't get it good enough to prove my point.

[normang]

Found this info posted elsewhere, and while it was mentioned over and over about the cost and how it can affect sales, this only confirms the obvious...
"On the PlayStation 3's first birthday today, as the console has not only doubled its sales in the US since that little price cut, but it also apparently outsold the Wii in Japan last week."

[Peter Cohen]

FWIW, I have a PS3 running about three feet away from an Xbox 360. The Xbox 360 is notably louder, even without a disc in the drive, than the PS3. The source of it is the fan noise from the Xbox 360, not the optical drive, for sure.

[Xaqtly]

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Xaqtly, you seem intent on having an argument here, despite the fact that I started this thread by noting that I decided a while ago that this fight wasn't worth having, and I got all three systems. I play games on the Mac and on Windows too, as a matter of fact.

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Is your memory so short that you don't remember what you said in your first post? Allow me to refresh your memory.
"That's why instead of getting into p*ing matches on Web sites to prove to myself that I made the right decision..."
That was directed at me, despite the fact that I hadn't said anything to you at that point. The irony is that you started this pissing match on this web site by saying it. And you're still here continuing it. And now you're telling me you're not the one with an axe to grind? Wait, let me sum up. You don't like a comment I made, so you respond to it like an ass instead of like a professional, which starts this pissing contest (your words, not mine), then you try to make yourself look like you're the good guy in this argument?
Are you insane? Tell you what, how about next time you don't begin a line of discussion by telling us how much better you are than everybody else because you don't start pissing contests. I bet things would go a lot more smoothly, don't you think? Oh yeah, and not attacking your own readers might be something to think about also. You're about as professional as a 2 dollar hooker Peter, at least Dan has been trying to keep it under control despite your best efforts to piss people off.
Oh and I'm sorry if you don't like my opinion, but as they say, tough cookies. I didn't ask for you to start a pissing contest, that was all you buddy. Pot meet kettle indeed.
Oh and now I bet you'll ban me despite the fact that you started (and continued) it. You really don't like people to have an opinion that differs from your own, do you?

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Life's too short to play favorites.

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Oh and I see you haven't mastered the long forgotten art of learning how to read, either. I did actually say that I would buy a PS3 if it had better exclusives. Right now I see it as a waste of money because most of the good games for it are available on the 360, and the 360 also has a nice roster of excellent exclusives. That is my opinion. If you don't like it, that is just too damn bad.

[MacCheetah3]

hi
Sorry Peter. My point wasn't the XBOX 360 isn't louder than the PS3. Considering how dense the PS3 construction looks, I'd say the PS3 would be quieter but my point was rather that I would by no stretch call the 360 loud ( outside of the optical drive ).

[Peter Cohen]

See, I would. /forums/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif Honestly, my Elite is really loud -- almost as loud as the fan on my video projector. Maybe it's abnormally loud, I dunno -- but I know that the PS3 and the Wii are much quieter comparatively.

[MacCheetah3]

Hi
Hhhmmm...I don't know how to respond to that. /forums/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif I could compare it to my Wii but...

[NeoX]

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Hi
Uh...The optical drive is most of the noise. It's not silent but not bad at all when playing arcade games off the HDD. I highly doubt the PS3 is silent. The biggest difference in audible noise is likely that all PS3s have HDDs to cache so the game disc can spin down; the disc doesn't spin down in the 360 unless you are in the Dashboard or playing an arcade game. I'm willing to admit there are shortcomings to the 360 and Wii, including the 360 failure rate -- though mine has been running ~14 months strong -- but let's not toss non-factual information into the stew.
P.S. I tried to record it but couldn't get it good enough to prove my point.

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What exactly is non factual? That the 360 is loud? That is what I said. That is a fact, I owned 2 of them before getting the PS3. The PS3 is quieter although the fans can kick up in it too.

[MacCheetah3]

Hi
OK...Maybe non-factual was the wrong thing to say. However, I asked two others and they would not use "loud" to describe the fans audible level. On top of that, it appears "loud' seems to be a quite subjective adjective.

[NeoX]

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Hi
OK...Maybe non-factual was the wrong thing to say. However, I asked two others and they would not use "loud" to describe the fans audible level. On top of that, it appears "loud' seems to be a quite subjective adjective.

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Yeah I think Loud is subjective. But what isn't subjective is if you have both a PS3 and a 360, you can hear the difference. I consider the 360 to be loud when I am playing an intensive game for a while. It is not as loud when you are simply playing an XBL Arcade game though. And yes I agree that the DVD drive does cause it to get louder for sure. Actually it really doesn't matter to me as long as they don't overheat and fail prematurely, which they do way too much. That is the main reason MS extended the regular warranty from 90 days to 1 year and extended the major cause of failure, the 3 lights or ring of death to 3 years. They wouldn't have needed to do this if the console wasn't sun unreliable. I never had a problem, personally. Well I take that back, my original 360 Premium use to have a brief stutter on the opening movie to Ridge Racer 6. The 360 elite I replaced it with did not exhibit this behavior. But I didn't use my 360 day in and day out.