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18 Replies Last post: May 23, 2008 10:20 AM by steve_smyth   1 2 Previous Next
Click to view Macworld's profile News & Columns Bot 5,928 posts since
Nov 30, 2007
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May 22, 2008 10:37 AM

Psystar skates on thin ice

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Click to view Grapho's profile Enthusiast 1,223 posts since
Aug 30, 2004
1. May 22, 2008 10:56 AM in response to: Macworld
Re: Psystar skates on thin ice
These guys already went to far. If you want to build your own Hackintosh, I think is one thing, distributing others intellectual property for monitory gain is a whole other story. I don't think their is a court in the world that would side with them at this point. They are going so down.

Now, what exactly is the deference between distributing iTunes vs. OSX? I think once they install the software and sell you the computer, they already crossed the line.
Click to view griffman's profile Macworld Editorial 8,043 posts since
Jan 9, 2001
2. May 22, 2008 11:26 AM in response to: Macworld
Re: Psystar skates on thin ice
On the one hand, Psystar selling a clone isn't much different than my selling my used MacBook Pro with OS X installed -- I purchased the copy of OS X 10.5 that's installed on the machine (it came with 10.4). When I sell it on eBay or whatever, I sell the hardware and the installed software, along with the licenses that came with that software.

The difference with Psystar was that they were violating the EULA by installing the software on a machine that didn't meet the restriction in the license. Still, as Wired noted, this isn't really something that Apple would want to address in a court -- there's no copyright violation going on, as they're simply selling a computer and the software (including the original box).

(One interesting twist to that statement, though, is that the OS X that's bundled with the machine is apparently unopened. If that's really the case, then Psystar technically violates copyright law when they install OS X -- if they're not installing the copy they purchased for your clone, then it can't be on your machine legally. But since this isn't first-hand knowledge, I don't know if it's really true.

But now that they're offering Apple's downloads, well, that's clearly a copyright violation, and I expect they have a bit of trouble ahead of them.

-rob.
Click to view Steve_S's profile Enthusiast 1,009 posts since
Sep 9, 2004
3. May 22, 2008 11:45 AM in response to: Macworld
Re: Psystar skates on thin ice
In principle, Apple needs to eventually take some action or it is inviting other, perhaps larger companies to do the same.

In terms of actually affecting Apple's bottom line, I don't believe Pystar represents any real threat. We've all seen how Apple has the ability to make something incompatible at their whim. From what I've ready so far (maybe I'm mistaken - I haven't used one), the Pystar seems to be a hack that you happen to be able to purchase. I couldn't imagine any significant number of people being stupid enough to trust such a machine for anything important.
Click to view bigh's profile Member 294 posts since
Oct 20, 2004
4. May 22, 2008 12:36 PM in response to: Macworld
Re: Psystar skates on thin ice
I can...
Click to view kincurtis's profile New Member 1 posts since
May 22, 2008
5. May 22, 2008 12:47 PM in response to: Macworld
Re: Psystar skates on thin ice
From Steve_S: "We've all seen how Apple has the ability to make something incompatible at their whim. From what I've ready so far (maybe I'm mistaken - I haven't used one), the Pystar seems to be a hack that you happen to be able to purchase. I couldn't imagine any significant number of people being stupid enough to trust such a machine for anything important."

It doesn't take long for a fix to be written. The Psystar machine is a good machine. It is shady, but it is still good.

From griffman: "But now that they're offering Apple's downloads, well, that's clearly a copyright violation, and I expect they have a bit of trouble ahead of them."

From ComputerWorld: "Apple's End User Licensing Agreement (EULA) doesn't expressly forbid others from posting the company's software updates, but it does ban others from copying or modifying its software. "Except as and only to the extent permitted by applicable licensing terms governing use of the Open-Sourced Components, or by applicable law, you may not copy, decompile, reverse engineer, disassemble, modify, or create derivative works of the Apple Software or any part thereof," according to the Mac OS X 10.5 EULA"
Click to view alansky's profile Member 348 posts since
Jul 14, 2004
6. May 22, 2008 1:02 PM in response to: Macworld
Re: Psystar skates on thin ice
When the other shoe drops, it's not gonna be pretty.
Click to view griffman's profile Macworld Editorial 8,043 posts since
Jan 9, 2001
7. May 22, 2008 1:37 PM in response to: kincurtis
Re: Psystar skates on thin ice
"From ComputerWorld: "Apple's End User Licensing Agreement (EULA) doesn't expressly forbid others from posting the company's software updates, but it does ban others from copying or modifying its software"

Psystar isn't just posting updates -- those programs I listed are full programs. Hence, Psystar is copying Apple's software, against the EULA. But even worse than that, it's against copyright law at its most basic level: Psystar hosting a full download for iTunes is no different than me hosting a download for Internet Explorer for Windows. Both are free, but Microsoft would not be happy with me if I were to offer it for download. It's their software, and they control the copyright, which is completely outside the realm of the EULA.

-rob.
Click to view sgbdeals's profile New Member 2 posts since
May 22, 2008
8. May 22, 2008 1:41 PM in response to: Macworld
Re: Psystar skates on thin ice
All of their downloads point to the apple.com site for download. Did they change it? I don't see anything wrong in referencing apple's own site.
Click to view Wondercow's profile Member 334 posts since
Jul 21, 2004
9. May 22, 2008 1:50 PM in response to: kincurtis
Re: Psystar skates on thin ice
kincurtis wrote:
From ComputerWorld: "Apple's End User Licensing Agreement (EULA) doesn't expressly forbid others from posting the company's software updates . . ."

It doesn't need to; distribution of copyrighted materials is an affirmative process where the copyright holder is allowed to dictate who may distribute their material. They don't need to specify that someone may not distribute their works, they need to specify who may.
Click to view heyspackle's profile New Member 1 posts since
May 22, 2008
10. May 22, 2008 1:57 PM in response to: sgbdeals
Re: Psystar skates on thin ice
Click to view sgbdeals's profile New Member 2 posts since
May 22, 2008
11. May 22, 2008 2:06 PM in response to: heyspackle
Re: Psystar skates on thin ice

Thanks heyspackle... It doesn't help their case that they are still hosting those files. You can still download the updates from their servers if you follow the links in google cache.

You'd think these guys would be smarter than this...

Click to view griffman's profile Macworld Editorial 8,043 posts since
Jan 9, 2001
12. May 22, 2008 2:14 PM in response to: sgbdeals
Re: Psystar skates on thin ice
Hmm. When I tested it with iTunes, I'm about 99% positive they weren't coming from Apple (I tested it before I wrote this article, though -- they've had their download page active for a couple weeks now). As of now, though, you're right -- the downloads are coming from Apple's site now.

I don't know when it changed; it may have already been like this when I wrote my article last night...

-rob.
Click to view griffman's profile Macworld Editorial 8,043 posts since
Jan 9, 2001
13. May 22, 2008 2:23 PM in response to: heyspackle
Re: Psystar skates on thin ice
Whew. Thanks for that Google cache link; I thought I was going crazy for a minute there! :)

-rob.
Click to view Heart_Man_2000's profile New Member 5 posts since
Feb 5, 2007
14. May 22, 2008 3:45 PM in response to: Macworld
Re: Psystar skates on thin ice
Unless Psystar is anticipating that it will need to "patch" Apple's updates, why would they distribute updates at all? Distributing Apple's updates is trouble enough, but distributing modified Apple updates is really "pulling on Superman's cape"!

Come to think of it, if the customer cannot install Leopard, but it must be done at the factory, isn't Psystar effectively reselling OS X?