Macworld: Too many mics, not enough preamps ...

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41 Replies Last post: Jul 3, 2008 9:16 AM by yikesboy1317 1 2 3 Previous Next

Macworld

5,959 posts since
Nov 30, 2007

Jun 25, 2008 4:27 PM

Too many mics, not enough preamps

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ampstudios

5 posts since
Jun 25, 2008

1. Jun 25, 2008 5:45 PM

in response to: Macworld

Re: Too many mics, not enough preamps

Your question makes no sense to me. You are frustrated that you don't have enough mic preamps and then finish by saying you want to invest in Apogee Symphony system which has no mic preamps. What will that give you other than a large bill for a slightly better sounding converter. The 003 does the exact same thing on the line inputs as the Apogee Symphony would do. So what are you gaining? You say you get to plug all your preamps into one system. That's exactly what you have to do with the OO3 that you are complaining about. If you want to do it for sound quality.... don't. Unless you have a lot of money, your money is far better spent on good quality mic preamps as this is where most of the sound comes from. If you can afford to buy 16 good quality mic preamps plus the Symphony, good for you, but if not, invest in the proper thing: mic preamps. An instrument will sound better any day running through an Avalon mic pre into your line input on the 003 than it will running through some crappy M-Audio preamp or Mackie Mixer into an Apogee Symphony. Just one professionals opinion!

Jim Dalrymple

225 posts since
Feb 16, 2004

2. Jun 25, 2008 6:41 PM

in response to: Macworld

Re: Too many mics, not enough preamps

ampstudios, thanks for the tip. I'll check out the Avalon mic pre.

Boris714

10 posts since
Sep 29, 2004

3. Jun 25, 2008 6:48 PM

in response to: Macworld

Re: Too many mics, not enough preamps

Why don't you just get 2 Audio Buddy's (M-Audio) and save $$.

SouLab

2 posts since
Dec 12, 2007

4. Jun 25, 2008 8:13 PM

in response to: Macworld

Re: Too many mics, not enough preamps

Am I counting 11 mics for the drums? Wow.

I'm guessing there's some "top & bottom drum head" miking going on here, among other things...

I have a 003 Rack here at home, and I was thinking you could possibly run another dual-channel mic pre with a S/PDIF out into the S/PDIF input of the 003, giving you the remaining 2 inputs you need. I don't know if PT will allow you to use the Octane connected via ADAT and the S/PDIF simultaneously, but maybe that's worth looking into. Good luck...

Jim Dalrymple

225 posts since
Feb 16, 2004

5. Jun 25, 2008 8:25 PM

in response to: Macworld

Re: Too many mics, not enough preamps

SouLab, that may be an idea. I don't know if it will take both either, but it's worth looking into. Yeah, I know it's a lot of mics for the drums, but damn they sound nice

Jim Dalrymple

225 posts since
Feb 16, 2004

6. Jun 25, 2008 8:29 PM

in response to: Macworld

Re: Too many mics, not enough preamps

Hey Boris, I think that must be what Digi was talking about.

SouLab

2 posts since
Dec 12, 2007

7. Jun 25, 2008 9:17 PM

in response to: Jim Dalrymple

Re: Too many mics, not enough preamps

If it does happen to work, mic pres with S/PDIF outs don't seem to be that common yet, but I know that ART & dbx definitely have some models available. Anyway, let us know with what you come up with.

BTW, a quick thanks for the great articles on Mac-related audio & recording stuff, especially this series of articles. Recording music is what made me move over to the Mac about 5 years ago. Keep 'em coming. Not every article can be about the iPhone, haha...

medienhexer

4 posts since
Jun 26, 2008

8. Jun 26, 2008 12:35 AM

in response to: Macworld

Re: Too many mics, not enough preamps

Hi

I too used to be frustrated by the limitations of PT le. I made the move and never looked back. Well, except for the Pultec EQs...

If I understand correctly, you´re willing to make another investment to get it right. So, all I can say is that I´m absolutely thrilled with the Mackie Onyx Series and the Firewire Option.

1. No Driver installation - standard Core Audio
2. Really good sounding Mic Preamps - a bit of warmth but without coloration of the sound. Very crisp highs without sounding thin, very dynamic and you get your 96/24 on 8-16 Mic Channels depending on which console you buy.
3. Not a single lost track, not a single lost take as of yet
4. Real mixing console with all the monitoring options (EQ is always post A/D conversion, so you can mix your headphone signal without compromising your tracks...)
5. No knitting a quilt out of all your patches

6. unlike with your patchworking, every Mic runs through the same Preamp and converter, which can not be a bad thing...

There is one con for me, as it can not produce the low latency a RME can, but I don´t play Softsynths so that doesn´t really bother me. A stable 128 - 256 Samples depending on the project can be achieved on your average iMac, I don´t know about the Mac Pro.

As far as giving the tracks to your mixing guy: just do a multibounce to export all the tracks (or the edited takes) as complete audio files of the same length and your Pro Tools-Wizard should be able to import it within seconds (if not, change da man). So it won´t really be much time loss compared to just opening the Pro Tools le session.

medienhexer

4 posts since
Jun 26, 2008

9. Jun 26, 2008 12:40 AM

in response to: Macworld

Re: Too many mics, not enough preamps

ah and the Onyx series is really affordable compared to Apogee-highend-stuff

medienhexer

4 posts since
Jun 26, 2008

10. Jun 26, 2008 12:43 AM

in response to: Macworld

Re: Too many mics, not enough preamps

and if you´re still two channels short, you can daisychain an Onyx satellite which has recently been a really good deal everywhere

Jim Dalrymple

225 posts since
Feb 16, 2004

11. Jun 26, 2008 6:18 AM

in response to: Macworld

Re: Too many mics, not enough preamps

SouLab, glad you are enjoying the articles. I'm having a blast doing them and getting some feedback from all of the Mac using musicians and engineers.

Jim Dalrymple

225 posts since
Feb 16, 2004

12. Jun 26, 2008 6:19 AM

in response to: Macworld

Re: Too many mics, not enough preamps

Quite a few recommendations for the Onyx.

medienhexer, what are you using for a DAW with the Onyx?

robertgmartin

1 posts since
Jun 26, 2008

13. Jun 26, 2008 6:26 AM

in response to: Macworld

Re: Too many mics, not enough preamps

Welcome to Digidesigns proprietary world. Here is how I worked around this.
I purchased a Mackie 1640 Onyx Mixer. I also purchased the FireWire adapter card (although that sees little use). I also purchased two sets of DB25 cables to hook up to the direct outs of the Mackie and ran those into my 003 Rack and 8 Port A-DAT interfaces. I keep the gains on digi and A-dat units off and control my gain for the 16 Onyx mic pres on the Mackie. It works very well. I primarily use Pro Tools but have purchased Logic 8 and really like that for many things, but audio editing is still easier for me in PT.

Yes I spent extra money to get around an annoying limitation, but the jump to PT HD was much more expensive and I am getting very good results.

Lastly, I must say, a little creativity on your part could give you the Preamps you need. You can purchase relatively inexpensive and transparent DI boxes for your Guitar and Bass and plug them into 1 of the other 4 ports on the Digi. If you are using the Line 6, you can control your gain on that. Same with the Bass if you are using some type of Bass Pedal.

Good luck.

Robert

Jim Dalrymple

225 posts since
Feb 16, 2004

14. Jun 26, 2008 6:34 AM

in response to: Macworld

Re: Too many mics, not enough preamps

Robert, thanks for the rundown on the Onyx. I know I could be creative with the number of interfaces I have, but I have some concerns about using too many devices in the chain.

Ultimately, I'd like to have one device connecting everything together or into the 003.

I love the interface on Logic 8.

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Jun 25, 2008 4:27 PM

Too many mics, not enough preamps

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