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14 Replies Last post: Jul 3, 2008 8:37 PM by People_Eater   Branched to a new thread.
Click to view Macworld's profile News & Columns Bot 6,610 posts since
Nov 30, 2007
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Jul 3, 2008 8:15 AM

Stevens Creek Software to debut three iPhone apps

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Click to view hypnocat's profile New Member 37 posts since
Jan 15, 2005
1. Jul 3, 2008 9:13 AM in response to: Macworld
Re: Stevens Creek Software to debut three iPhone apps
wow, i hope they plan on improving the UI. that screenshot looks like a very inelegant Palm application. but it's exciting to see trip planning/tracking software coming to the iPhone. i'll have to see what the final version looks like.
Click to view hypnocat's profile New Member 37 posts since
Jan 15, 2005
2. Jul 3, 2008 9:20 AM in response to: Macworld
Re: Stevens Creek Software to debut three iPhone apps
addendum: yeek. i looked at the website and that does appear to be the final screen. particularly, that cyan background is hard on the eyes, and the button layout looks crowded and laid out haphazardly. guess i'll wait for someone else to create a better designed one, or for Stevens Creek Software to get some UI consultation...
Click to view nmpike's profile Member 362 posts since
Feb 13, 2004
3. Jul 3, 2008 9:28 AM in response to: Macworld
Re: Stevens Creek Software to debut three iPhone apps
A couple of questions, how are they (Steven's Creek Software) legally showing screen shots? We can't show ours until July 11th...

2) Apple is very strict on what's going on the iPhone, I cannot believe those loud colors and blatant violations of the iPhone HIG would get approved to be on the store.

I know Monkey Ball and the others shown at WWDC are considered public information... but this was not at the WWDC keynote...
Click to view hypnocat's profile New Member 37 posts since
Jan 15, 2005
4. Jul 3, 2008 9:38 AM in response to: nmpike
Re: Stevens Creek Software to debut three iPhone apps
good points. most companies are not being allowed to preview their applications before the Apple Store is launched. i'd venture that Stevens Creek Software downloaded the SDK, created their apps, and have started to advertise them without actually submitting the apps to Apple yet.

i thought the trip software looked bad, but the other two applications look terrible, especially "Handy Randy":
http://stevenscreek.com/iPhone/handyrandy.htm

it burns! it burns!
Click to view Howmanoid's profile New Member 11 posts since
Aug 28, 2007
5. Jul 3, 2008 9:53 AM in response to: Macworld
Re: Stevens Creek Software to debut three iPhone apps
Oh boy do these guys have a lot to learn about UI design. That's a whole lot of ugly!!! Bet it's pretty unusable too. I'll pass!
Click to view nmpike's profile Member 362 posts since
Feb 13, 2004
6. Jul 3, 2008 10:58 AM in response to: Macworld
Re: Stevens Creek Software to debut three iPhone apps
I think we will see a lot of this if Apple doesn;t intervene.... there are those of us who have used or developed for Mac for a long time... we have come to expect a certain level of quality...

A lot of iPhone developers have no UI experience... they wrote stuff for Palm, or Windows Mobile, or Windows... and there is nothing classy, stylish, tasteful, etc in any of those platforms.

They will quickly learn why they call us "Mac Snobs".

I would love an app that tracks time and mileage... but no way in hell am I going to get a headache looking at those colors.

mike
Click to view leftionthenews's profile New Member 3 posts since
Jul 3, 2008
7. Jul 3, 2008 11:00 AM in response to: Macworld
Re: Stevens Creek Software to debut three iPhone apps
Actually "pretty" and "usability" can be in opposition. When there is are a lot of different pieces of information to enter, you can put them all on a series of separate screens (e.g., entering a new name into your contact list in the iPhone Contacts app) or put them in a more crowded scenario where everything can be accomplished from the same screen.

With contacts, the typical situation is that you enter a new one only rarely, so the slower, cleaner, "more screens" approach is fine. With an application you use every day to log information, and which you just want to "get in and get out" in the quickest possible time, the faster, perhaps less "elegant" approach has strong advantages. I know I appreciate a software problem which doesn't waste my time with unnecessary keystrokes or screen taps; I appreciate a program which does what I want it to do as quickly as possible and lets me get on with my life.
Click to view hypnocat's profile New Member 37 posts since
Jan 15, 2005
8. Jul 3, 2008 11:28 AM in response to: leftionthenews
Re: Stevens Creek Software to debut three iPhone apps
ah, but with good UI design you should be able to accomplish both. while i don't doubt that this single-screen approach used in this particular app gets the job done, my point is it doesn't have to be fugly and haphazardly arranged. this developer's software very well may function great but is so unpolished looking it resembles a high school VB programming project. given the choice over this and something that performs the same task but looks like a proper iPhone app, it's pretty clear which one i'm going to go with.
Click to view Neil_Anderson's profile New Member 100 posts since
Jun 23, 2007
9. Jul 3, 2008 12:00 PM in response to: Macworld
Re: Stevens Creek Software to debut three iPhone apps
Whoa. Didn't know it was possible to make apps that ugly for the iPhone. Guess I was wrong. :)


http://www.cyclelogicpress.com
Click to view leftionthenews's profile New Member 3 posts since
Jul 3, 2008
10. Jul 3, 2008 12:51 PM in response to: Macworld
Re: Stevens Creek Software to debut three iPhone apps
It's easy to make apps look clean and elegant...if they don't actually do much. When they actually are used for applications out in the real world, it's a different story.

For example, just looking at this screen, it could be much cleaner and more elegant if only that huge "picker" weren't on the screen. Just one minor detail...every time you wanted to enter mileage, which is every single time you use the application, you'd have to tap a button and wait for it to slide onto the screen.

Again, different apps have different functions. As for me, when I'm looking for an app to record something I do every day, my #1 criterion is functionality, and #2 is speed/minimum number of steps to accomplish the task. A distant #3 is looks. If I have to pick an app which sacrifices #3 to gain #1 or #2, I will.

"hypnocat" above says "with good UI design you should be able to accomplish both. Easier said than done. Again, take a look at the Contacts app and how convoluted a process it is to enter a new contact and all the information associated with them, which has a certain "elegance" (and actually, certain inelegance as well, in my opinion), but it takes one heck of a lot of taps to enter the information, and I'm not counting the actual "information" taps to enter the name itself etc. I'm not saying I could design a better one, maybe I could, maybe I couldn't, but there are ALWAYS tradeoffs. Pretending there aren't is just delusional.
Click to view People_Eater's profile Member 157 posts since
Sep 12, 2006
11. Jul 3, 2008 5:09 PM in response to: leftionthenews
Re: Stevens Creek Software to debut three iPhone apps
leftionthenews wrote:
Actually "pretty" and "usability" can be in opposition.

Pray tell, how does the cyan background help usability? How does the haphazard arrangement of text help usability? How does having much of the screen taken up with the gimmicky "scrolling wheel odometer" enhance usability?

Funny, I don't recall anybody here saying that prettiness and usability are the same thing. In fact, nobody even mentioned the word "pretty". Good UI design is more about elegance, simplicity and appropriate use of space. This application appears to have none of those attributes.

I think that people who think that the "Apple approach" to UI design is just about looking good really have no idea what it involves.
Click to view People_Eater's profile Member 157 posts since
Sep 12, 2006
12. Jul 3, 2008 5:14 PM in response to: leftionthenews
Re: Stevens Creek Software to debut three iPhone apps
leftionthenews wrote:
It's easy to make apps look clean and elegant...if they don't actually do much.

Right. But there are plenty of apps out there that do a lot more than this, and still have a clean interface.

If I have to pick an app which sacrifices #3 to gain #1 or #2, I will.

But once again, we're not just talking about looks.

"hypnocat" above says "with good UI design you should be able to accomplish both. Easier said than done.

Who said that good user interface design was easy? It is damn hard. Which is why it should be left to the experts, and software companies that don't bother investing any effort into UI design or human factor should go out of business. They're the software equivalent of industrial polluters, or the manufacturers of faulty toys.
Click to view leftionthenews's profile New Member 3 posts since
Jul 3, 2008
13. Jul 3, 2008 5:50 PM in response to: People_Eater
Re: Stevens Creek Software to debut three iPhone apps

How does having much of the screen taken up with the gimmicky "scrolling wheel odometer" enhance usability?

Well, as I see it looking at the screen, this is the means for entering the mileage for a particular trip. The alternative, I guess, would be just a text field, which would require the user to touch it, activating a keyboard or keypad which slides onto the screen, letting the user enter the mileage, and then tapping a "Done" or "Return" or whatever to dismiss the keypad, requiring two unnecessary taps. The way it is, the user simply dials in the mileage. And it provides the added elegance (in my view) of mimicking the trip odometer on the user's car which is precisely what they are trying to enter, hence, it likely looks and feels "familiar." Just my opinion, obviously.

And you talk about the "gimmicky" scrolling wheel as if that is an invention of this developer. In fact, it is a standard iPhone selection mechanism, an alternative to drop-down menus which don't exist. In the standard apps, it shows up in the Timer app (part of Clock) and of course in the Calendar app as a date/time selector. Perhaps you consider those "gimmicky" as well; if so, your quarrel is with Apple, not with this developer.

Pray tell, how does the cyan background help usability?

Well, no more or less than the manila (?) background in Apple's "Notes" application increases usability. It doesn't, particularly. It does, again looking at the picture, provide a pleasing neutral pastel background which simultaneously contrasts with both the white "log" on the bottom of the screen, and the black text labels and white buttons elsewhere on the screen. So in that sense, helping the user to visually isolate the different elements, I would say it does help usability.

Do you think the light gray background of the iTunes app, for example, is any better or worse at "helping usability"? Is it any more or less eye-pleasing than a light-blue pastel color? Do you really think this app would be enhanced if the background were white, or light gray? How and why?

Click to view People_Eater's profile Member 157 posts since
Sep 12, 2006
14. Jul 3, 2008 8:37 PM in response to: leftionthenews
Re: Stevens Creek Software to debut three iPhone apps
leftionthenews wrote:
Well, as I see it looking at the screen, this is the means for entering the mileage for a particular trip.

What? Why doesn't it use the iPhone's GPS to do that? I thought that was the point of the application.

The alternative, I guess, would be just a text field, which would require the user to touch it, activating a keyboard or keypad which slides onto the screen, letting the user enter the mileage, and then tapping a "Done" or "Return" or whatever to dismiss the keypad, requiring two unnecessary taps.

Why not just have the figures without the scrolly wheel, and you simply rub your finger up and down over the number itself to change it? No need for a "done" button or wasted screen real-estate.

Perhaps you consider those "gimmicky" as well; if so, your quarrel is with Apple, not with this developer.

I don't have a quarrel. I just think it wastes space.

Well, no more or less than the manila (?) background in Apple's "Notes" application increases usability. It doesn't, particularly.

It's designed to imitate the yellow paper frequently found in physical notebooks. What is the cyan color trying to evoke?

It does, again looking at the picture, provide a pleasing neutral pastel background which simultaneously contrasts with both the white "log" on the bottom of the screen,

Ahem, pleasing? That is a hideous color. And it's far from neutral. Do you work for this software company or something?

Do you think the light gray background of the iTunes app, for example, is any better or worse at "helping usability"? Is it any more or less eye-pleasing than a light-blue pastel color?

Much more pleasing. It's neutral. It doesn't distract. That cyan is just an eyesore that would make me want to avoid the application.

Do you really think this app would be enhanced if the background were white, or light gray? How and why?

It would be better if it were a darker, more neutral color. Because it would mean less eyestrain, and less revulsion on behalf of the user. It would also help the interface elements stand out better. They are overwhelmed by that bright background.